It was reported today that the “agreement between Rifqa Bary and her parents to settle their conflict through counseling has ended without a single meeting between the parents and their daughter” and that the parents are “withdrawing their consent to resolve the case.â€
 On Jan. 19, the parents had agreed that Rifqa should stay in foster care and that they would all go to counseling together rather than go through a dependency trial.However, the motion filed Friday in Franklin County Juvenile Court states; “The parents now believe the entire deal should be thrown out because of misrepresentation and fraudulent inducement.” Apparently, despite their request, Rifqa, with the help of her attorney, had contacted the Pastor that had helped her run away.
Ok. Â I know how most everyone feels. Â But can I say just a couple things?
We can all make assumptions about the motivations of the Bary’s until the cows come home.  But I don’t know them, and neither do most of you.  Yes, it’s true that they are Muslims.  Yes, it’s true that Sharia law is a very real danger.  Yes, it’s true that the Bary’s have accepted help from CAIR and CAIR is a radical org tied to terrorism. But does that mean the Bary’s would be willing to murder their daughter? None of us really know.Â
I am a conservative, evangelical Christian. I can understand Rifqa, but I can also commiserate with the Bary’s. I have raised nine kids, and I, too, once had a 17-year-old runaway. She has since returned, lives nearby, and comes over almost every day, but I too, had to deal with other “Christian†families interfering – at a time when what I really needed was their support.  They honestly thought they were helping her, but truthfully, they had no idea what was going on.  They knew only the surface of my daughter – who had gone through four years with her father dying of cancer. We lost him when she was 16. Suffice it to say, these “well-meaning†people, in taking their ill-thought stance against the only parent she had left, did not help matters at all. Â
So, you say, “err on the side of safety for Rifqa.† Fine.  But there are a couple of points I would like to make.  They have to do with being Christian – meaning, Rifqa, being who she says she is. Those who aren’t Christian might not understand what I am trying to say.  But those who are Christians know the following to be true. Being a Christian involves a heart for the lost and a desire to pursue God’s purposes. It’s not all about us.
Even if Rifqa never goes back to live with her parents, she, as a Christian, needs to honor them. She needs to treat them with love and respect. That’s just a fact. By not communicating with them, but instead, communicating with the people in Florida, even calling the man down there “Dad,†she is tremendously hurting her father and she knows it.  That’s not Christ-like, and I am appalled that the family in Florida is allowing it. (Although their church now seems be trying to honor the parents and court.)
But even further – and here is where it gets tricky – Rifqa has the potential to be the “Esther” in her family. Up until now, she has not fulfilled the opportunity God has given her to be a light to her parents – showing them the way out of Islam. I pray that the members of her Ohio church are counseling her Christian walk, acutely aware of her need to be a Godly witness to her family. Being a Christian isn’t all about getting what we want.  In fact, it can be quite the opposite.  Remember Jonah? We are to lay aside our own wants and take up the cross for others.  There are verses I could quote, such as John 15:13 – but non-Christians might get their knickers all in a knot if I do. Â
As Christians, we are all called to bigger things. I pray we can all be brave enough to step up to the plate when God’s call becomes clear.
I’m not saying that I know what God is calling Rifqa to do. Although David honored Saul, and Daniel braved the Lion’s Den, maybe God has called Rifqa to something else, shaking the dust from her sandal.  God only knows what He has called Rifqa to. I don’t know - I am just afraid that in all the cacophony of voices, and apparently not-so-good Christian counsel, she might not know, either.  I pray that whatever He is asking of her, it becomes clear and she is willing.
And I’m not saying that taking up one’s cross is easy, if that is what is called for.  I’m not saying that I wouldn’t want to run and hide if I were faced with what Rifqa is facing.  All I am saying is; too often, we here in America forget what our faith is really all about.Â
I pray that God reveals to me exactly what He would have ME do, and I have the temerity and Grace to do it.  Have you ever read “Safely Home†by Randy Alcorn? Wow. That’s a book that turns everything around. I highly recommend it.
Lisa Blogs at Serving the Kings Tea  http://servingthekingstea.blogspot.com
and Dying in Indian Country http://dyinginindiancountry.blogspot.com/
37 users commented in " Did Rifqa Bary fudge the agreement? "
Follow-up comment rss or Leave a TrackbackI’m an adopted mom with a very troubled 13 year old adopted daughter. There have been many who have listened to our child bad mouth us. Many have interfered not knowing what is going on. That’s life
Still, Rifqa is only 14. It’s hard for her to be a light to her parents, especially if she is afraid of them.
A child needs a father. If the man in Fla is filling that role for her she can call him dad. She needs a dad.
Through the Holy Spirit she and through maturity in her walk with Jesus she will come to honor her bio dad. She may not be able to do that now.
Thanks for the note. Re: Rifqa – I would agree that if Rifqa were younger it might be different. But Rifqa is 17. She’ll be 18 in August.
Also, I’ve listened to the audio tapes of Rifqa’s depostion. She’s been seeking out many “Dad’s” it seems like. She talks on the one hand about how she kept things secret, but on the other hand, is giving lists and lists of people – including many men – that she has told about the issues through the years. She’d been hiding her Christianity for about 3 years.
Now, about kids bad mouthing. Hey, I’ve also had legal custody of four kids that weren’t my own. All four suffered from FAS, attachment issues, and ADD. Two are now over 18, and I learned lots the hard way with them. I now have the third one getting professional help, and wish I’d done that for the older two while I still had a chance. I strongly recommend that – if you are already seeing difficulties, and you don’t know for sure what her experience was while in womb…get help. It will be a long, long trek through the teen years without it, and the final results, as with our two older ones, might be horrid. The two older ones sought out their birth parents last year and are currently living with them, drinking and doing drugs.
By the way – that was an additional stress to my birth daughter, and might have been even worse than dealing with my husband’s illness. Growing up with four kids that had these many issues.
Which brings me back to Rifqa. While I was listening to her on the audio – the bubbly, innocent, overly polite,….hmmm… how do I say this. You know that when your 13 yr old is bad mouthing you, she does it in a way that gets the sympathy of other adults, right? She’s real sweet around them, am I wrong?
The girl I had did the same thing. Very bubbly, appearance of complete innocense, but very deceitful, very much craving whatever attention she could get. She was that way from the time she came into our home when she was 5 yrs old.
I hear that in Rifqa’s voice, and it makes me cautious. Again, not that Sharia doesn’t exist. But …as I was saying with my own children, and your 13 yr-old, we have to be aware that there are other things going on under the surface.
And I have to say, that there is a possiblity that Rifqa is a Christian in name only – using it as a tool to obtain something, whether it be the angst of her parents or the attention of a very giving and gullible group of people.
Others that haven’t experienced the extent some children might go to might not believe that. But it wouldn’t be the first time I’ve run into adults that can’t wrap their heads around kids with deep seated problems.
I’m just saying. It’s easy for everyone watching the news in their living room to assume the parents are villians, simply because Rifqa tells us they are.
Maybe they are and she really is innocent of any deceit. But I doubt she’s totally innocent, especially since she told the deposers that she’d been deceiving her parents in other areas as well, like with cheerleading. She thought it was funny that they didn’t know what cheerleading was, so she dressed modestly at home, and then changed into her cheerleading outfit at school. And this was during the time she was professing Christ.
Sharia is real, and evil. Rifqa doesn’t deserve to die. But Rifqa isn’t the sweet innocent she portrays herself as, either. She laughed a lot while talking about how she has deceived her parents. And any normal parent that finds out they have been lied to feels hurt and anger.
The word ‘shariah’ has the same derivation as the hebrew word ‘halacha’ (path or road).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halakha
Halacha was given to Moses by God and is the Biblical Law that Jews have followed for thousands of years. Even Jesus himself followed this Law but did change some of its rulings. And Jesus said that this Law will remain until heaven & earth pass away.
Muslims say that God gave the same Law to Muhammad but in arabic it is called shariah & its rulings are 99% same as the Law of Moses!
So why do you call it evil?
Sharia law is not practised in Sri Lanka. In fact Muslims on the island of Sri Lanka are some of the most easy going people you can find anywhere. I worked for a prominent charity on the island for 6 years.
That’s exactly the reason her parents allowed her to be a cheerleader.
Honour Killings have nothing to do with Islam. In fact there has never been a reported case of an honour killing on the island of Sri Lanka. Honour killings are a cultural practise. Hindus in India are notorious for honour killings, but the Muslims in India are not. So there is a clear difference, and blatant ignorance shown amongst Christians in the US.
When you work it all out, you realise Rifqa converted when she was 12. Will you let your 12 year old be influenced by people she met on the internet, and ask yourself if you will allow your 12 year old to convert to another religion.
As Christians we must condemn the actions of our fellow Christians, and call them out.
I have been to the very parts of the world where islam rules. In every country where islam rules, you will be killed, it is against the law to leave islam. Leaving Christanity is welcomed. In every one of those countries it is not a capital offence to kill a Christian. The list goes on and on.
Muslims are taught from birth that Sharia Law is above any manmade law, including those Muslims who are in America. Not only did the FT. Hood shooter say that but the 5 young men from Virginia who went to pakistan to kill Americans. Just because she is in America means nothing to her parents.
This 17 year old girl is no fool, she knows full well what the Muslim ummah expects of her parents.
If it were not for those so called “well meaning Christian”, this girl would without a doubt have dissapeared back to Sri lanka to a forced marriage, or if she still continued to resist, a women’s prison. So if you really consider yourself a Christian, stand up and do something, words are cheap.
LTCUSA – I don’t think you read what was written by myself or by Pamela.
As I have written, you really don’t know for a fact what would happen if Rifqa went back.
Esther, through prayer, fasting, obedience and faith – honoring her Uncle’s request – lived.
Daniel, through prayer, fasting, obedience and faith – honoring the Lord God – lived.
David, through prayer, fasting, obedience and faith – honoring Saul’s position – lived.
And the list goes on.
Further, as already posted, you really have no idea of what is going on other than what Rifqa has said and what the news has reported. That means only her side of the story.
As a Christian, I AM standing up and doing something. I wrote this!
Tell me what else you think I can or should do in this situation? Fly to Ohio and confront…hmmm…which one? Whom do I confront and what do I say? What basis do I have to confront anyone? What the heck are you talking about?
Please listen & call in to the live radio talk show between Rifqa’s dear friend Jamal Jivanjee and Atlas Shrugs Pamela Geller going on now from 1pm-2pm (est) – http://www.blogtalkradio.com/atlasshrugs/2010/01/31/rifqa-barys-friend-and-pastor-jamal-jivanjee
I don’t have the right to say to Rifqa that you are to allow your parents to wipe out your life and call that submission to God. She is an apostate in the eyes of Islam and an honor killing is the remedy. As a Christian that is not okay to me. We are told to rescue those who have been delivered up to death, to care for the poor, abused and oppressed of the earth. That is the mandate for following Jesus. That is our mandate and Rifqa and all the Rifqa’s fit that bill. We are to risk our lives to protect them, not shrink back in fear for our lives and throw them to the Muslim bully who just happens to be her flesh and blood parent. God and the world are watching this case. We pray and stand up for what is right and break the back of the stranglehold that Islam is trying to put on the world. Islam’s goal is to prevent a person from seeking the face of Almighty God. We say “NO!” and we work to free the slavery of Islam. We do not bow to the spirit of this age and expect their blood to not be on our hands. Pray and work for Rifqa’s freedom to worship God. The world is watching and we Christians better step up to the plate and stop hiding behind misappropriation of the scripture.
This is about a girl and her parents.
The war on terror is being fought in Afghanistan.
If you feel strongly, as a Christian, about fighting Muslim strongholds, that is an extremely worthy cause and there are dozens of Missionary organizations, both here and abroad, that need your help. Step up to the plate. They could use your money and time.
Further, Americans have shown their guts and determination to keep their country as is last week in Massachusetts. I have no fear of what Islam might do to America. Christian America will stand it’s ground.
Lastly, No one said anything about throwing Rifqa to Muslim Bullies. What I said was – honor your parents, which is the first commandment with promise.
If Rifqa ia a Christian, she knows that Commandments are not suggestions. Her father told her not to contact the Florida family, therefore, she should not contact the Florida family.
Again, you have not lived in the Bary household. You don’t know anything more than the rest of us know – which is only what Rifqa has said.
But what I do know is that God gives us all opportunities and purposes. We all need to seek Him about those opportunities.
Let me remind people of something.
We have a justice system in America. As imperfect as it is, it is one of the best justice systems in the world. It is not Sharia, and for that we are extremely grateful.
So realize that Rifqa is in the legal system. OUR legal system.
You can gather protesters, picket court rooms, and rile people on the radio, but if there is any justice in our court system, public opinion will not have any effect on the court decisions.
WE DON’T WANT public opinion to affect court decisions, do we? That’s what makes our court system different – and more “Just” than other systems, right?
So PRAY. But pray for God’s will, not your own. Fast for Rifqa. But fast that she will hear God’s voice and direction, NOT yours or mine. Pray that she will get away from the attention and loud voices, and find a peaceful place and time to talk to just Him – God – just she and Him.
That’s all.
Do you trust God to know and do what is right for Rifqa? Do you truly trust God to protect her? Are you afraid He will make a mistake?
Sounds like you believe that the “Christians” who prayed and did nothing during WW2 did the right thing by not hiding the Jews and by letting them go to the death camps and become lampshades. Corrie Ten Boom did the wrong thing by taking them into her home and so did the rest of her family, most of whom died alongside the Jews in the death camps. I suppose MLK should have never marched to bring down the demon of racism as much as he did. The black slaves should never have run away to gain freedom. The Christians that did nothing were in the right again, especially if they were not black. How about Jesus who rocked the world of the religious leaders and Pharisees. Was he wrong for speaking against their hypocrisy and teaching his disciples to confront the pious evil? How about Moses? He didn’t bow to the wishes of the oppressor. He brought down Egypt and delivered the people of God. If we don’t stand up for 1 little girl, what makes you think that we will stand up when the pressure is on us? If we can not see that something must be confronted and called evil if that is plainly what it is then something is wrong with that brand of Christianity. You can honor your parents without agreeing to talk to them when you know that it is useless. What is the point of having them meet anyway. After 17 years of living with them if she doesn’t understand what they believe it is too late. It sounds like you are very suspicious of teenagers and their motives and can’t imagine a decent one in the bunch. Not all teenagers are awful creatures; there are a lot of awesome kids around. And, I trust God to take care of her and He trusts His people to do the same as His representatives here. To close our eyes and blame it on whether God comes through for her or not is ignorant and cowardly and cruel. I don’t think that would wash with God either.
Obviously you aren’t reading what I am actually writing.
Thank you for your notes. Thank God for opportunities to fellowship together. Thank You, God, for allowing your body of Christ to sharpen itself continually as various issues come up and we are free to talk about them.
God be with you, sister. May God’s presence be with you.
Lisa–thank you so much for a thoughtful post. I have watched this case transpire and I have been alarmed at the amount of bigotry that it engenders. I have read some really horrid things suggested–many coming from assumptions about what all Muslims are like. You are right–our legal system may not be perfect–but far superior to many. Ditto the child protection system. I have been up close and personal for many years and I can quote chapter and verse about the failings of the system. But–the biggest weakness is that social workers are not psychic.
But–I believe that those of us who have fostered or adopted have a keen sense of how important family truly is and what an incredible wound it is to lose one. I am intensely happy that my children came to me through adoption when their biological families could not raise them. Yet, I support the preservation of families as the first choice whenever that is possible. Far too many people believe that a child in an imperfect family can be “fixed” by merely moving them to a better place. Not so. I have known families who faced accusations from their adopted children that were in reality reports of the things that happened in the biological family being levelled (by the children) against a safer target. I have know of children who learned manipulative means of survival that threw their adoptive families into chaos.
I was delighted when it looked like an agreement had been reached between Rifqa and her family–so they could get out of court and out of the public eye–so that they can all work on the things that need to be worked on. But, I, like you, can see some consistency in Rifqa’s behavior. She has been sneaking behind her parent’s back for awhile, and apparently gotten pretty good at it. Her mother wouldn’t let her be a cheerleader, so she asked her father. Her sneaking wasn’t about going to church on Sunday with a school friend. She was hanging around campus at college age Bible studies–something that should concern any parent. When her foster family wouldn’t mail the card that she sent to Pastor Lorenz, she asked her attorney to mail it. I think that she has developed a real pattern of secretive behavior–and a lack of a certain kind of Christian grounding in a community that includes families and parents and children who worship together.
I do hope that this latest action might spark a concern about where and with whom she is worshipping. She really needs an experience that can support her as a growing and developing teen, as well as a religious being.
Amen! – to your note, and in particular the hope that you have. Thank you for understanding what I’ve been trying to say.
I’ve raised nine kids – 5 birth and 4 legal custody. Every one of them a unique learning experience. I now have two grandchildren, one of whom is crawling up my back and over my head as I write.
There have been red flags jumping out at me for quite awhile concerning this case. I’ve felt the need to put it on paper for about a month.
Luke 14:26 NIV “If anyone comes to me and does not hate his father and mother, his wife and children, his brothers and sisters—yes, even his own life—he cannot be my disciple.
So by proclaiming to be a Christian, Rifqa is instructed by Christ that she (and all of us) must put our earthly familial relationships aside in order to be his disciple. If you value your relationship with your parents more than your relationship with him, you are not worthy of him and are not saved. This applies to all of us, not just those of us who have religious, political, or philosophical differences with our parents. Are you willing to sever ties to your family for Jesus’ sake? If not, you are no Christian. Rifqa Bary is more Christian than most of us for being willing to cast off her family ties for Jesus. There is no greater obligation for a Christian in the Bible. She is doing the right thing according to Jesus own words.
Joe–as an adult, I have indeed made such choices. I adopted transracially and knew that I might lose some family relationships (my parents were already deceased) as a result. The path has been rocky, but generally we have been blessed with acceptance. But–what I choose as an adult is something quite different from the expectation that I would lay on a child. What I find particularly galling in this case is the many Christian voices from the sidelines who make such suggestions. I don’t know if you have children, but imagine if someone you don’t know approached them, behind your back, ad used that passage to justify their leaving home and going to follow Jesus, say by living on a commune with other Christians. Do you think that they might be over-reaching a bit on their use of the passage in that context?
Rifqa Bary was not kidnapped and held against her will. She made the choice for herself and 17 is old enough for her to make that decision. She knows that her parents and the Muslim community will pressure her to return to Islam and could very well execute her if she does not comply. Yes, she will die a martyr as surely as St. Joan and go to heaven but she may also recant under pressure and in so doing be condemned. She needs to be removed from the influence of her parents to save her soul. Do you want to see this girl condemned to hellfire for all eternity? I find that suggestion even more galling. Any obligation Rifqa Bary may have had to her parents was lifted when she took on the mantle of Christianity and dedicated her life to Him.
Joe – I understand that the Bible can be confusing at times.
Luke 14:26 does NOT mean that every Christian is supposed to hate everyone in their family, and if they don’t, they are going to hell.
It means that when push comes to shove, we have to understand that God comes first.
God is number one, and everyone and everything in our lives comes next. That’s all it means.
If it meant other than that, the 5th Commandment wouldn’t exist. Not only does it exist, but the statement, with it’s promise, is repeated several times throughout the Scripture.
As a matter of fact;
Matthew 15:3-5 (New International Version)
3Jesus replied, “And why do you break the command of God for the sake of your tradition? 4For God said, ‘Honor your father and mother'[a] and ‘Anyone who curses his father or mother must be put to death.'[b] 5But you say that if a man says to his father or mother, ‘Whatever help you might otherwise have received from me is a gift devoted to God,’
Is the Bible contradictory? No. It just needs to be studied in context, and with an understanding of the original language. The Greek word Miseo means “hate,” but Luke 14:26 falls into a category of “extreme language,” the language of absoluteness used to express a preference, and may refer to disattachment, indifference, or nonattachment without any feelings of revulsion involved.
And to your other point – No. In America, we follow the American system of Justice and we respect parental rights. Again, we praise God for that. Many other nations don’t give their people that blessing. Rifqa’s parents have not been found guilty of anything.
Removing her from her parents influence to save her soul? Sounds like the Middle Ages. Funny you would bring up Joan of Arc, who was burned at the stake in order to “save her soul.” Fortunately, the Catholic church no longer does such things, recognizes that it has no power over souls, and has ceased all efforts to force salvation.
It is slightly hyperbolic to suggest that if Rifqa honors her father by not contacting the Florida family (getting back to one of the points of my original message) that she will be condemned to hell for all eternity.
But I understand if you don’t agree. God Bless you, my brother. May God give you peace and assurance that if Rifqa is His child, He is in control.
And Joe – I’m sorry – I forgot that Catholics number the Commandments differently than Protestants. The Commandment I was referring to is the one that states, “Honor your father and your mother, so that you may live long in the land the LORD your God is giving you.” Exodus 20:12
What an awesome promise for Rifqa, as well as for all of us. Good talking to you, brother.
By the way, Christian Adoptive Mom – I agree completely re: how one would feel if outsiders came in and interfered with my child raising.
When the Moonies or other controlling religions have done this, we have recognized them as cults. Christianity is not a cult. God does not call us to kidnap children. (and I don’t believe that’s what the Idaho Baptist church was doing in Haiti, either. I think they were meaninng to help, but didn’t understand how to go about it properly. That’s why it’s best to work hand in hand with larger organizations that have had a long term presence in Haiti)
“If anyone comes to me and does not hate his father and mother, his wife and children, his brothers and sisters—yes, even his own life—he cannot be my disciple. And anyone who does not carry his cross and follow me cannot be my disciple.” – Luke 14:26-27
My interpretation is that a child is supposed to honor his or her parents, absolutely, unless their parents are threatening to kill them.
We should not be judging Rifqa for her actions. This is a clear case. The fact that her parents’ attorneys are taking back what they filed on January 19th is evidence that they are not going to leave her alone.
One last note is that even after Rifqa turns 18, the persecution that Rifqa is getting will never go away. She will continue to be hounded for the rest of her life because she made her statement of faith in Christ public. In Muslim terms, not only is Rifqa an apostate, she is a publicly stated, on the record, apostate. This alone will embitter some extreme groups out there. Rifqa will be on the run, looking around her shoulder from now on.
I agree that a child should honor their mother and father. But to what extent to you wish to draw that? Shouldn’t the parents also be honoring the child? According to Rifqa’s affidavit, her father held a lap top over his head and said that he was going to kill her. Rifqa definently took that as him wanting to kill her. He even admitted in the very flawed FDLE report that he held the lap top up over his head. He, of course, denied that he was trying to hurt her. He instead stated that he didn’t want to damage the computer. I found that weird — that he didn’t want to damage the computer. But what about his daughter?
In our legal system a child has rights, too, unlike under Sharia law where a child, especially a female child, is the property of the parents (father, really) and they can do whatever they wish. And as you probably are well aware that often times those rights are contradictory to the parents rights. This is the reason our court system has created the Guardian Ad Litem. My impression of Rifqa is not that of a juvenile deliquent, but of a young girl who is very afraid of what her family might do to her.
Please also realize that this is the second time that her parents have broken their settlement agreement. That from my point of view should draw suspicion towards the parents not Rifqa. The first time they agreed to allow Rifqa to stay in foster care until she was 18 so they would not have to produce their immmigration records. However, as Rifqa was on her way to Ohio the reniged and filed for the unruly proceedings once she got in Ohio.
Now, they are once again pulling out of this second agreement alleging misrepresentation and fradulent inducement. I wouldn’t be surprised that her parents might have been trying to force Rifqa to see a Muslim counselor, and she most likely refused to see her or him. I agree they all need counseling, but her parents need to quit treating her conversion to Christianity as a thing that needs therapy. She most likely needs therapy for whatever kind of abuse she has suffered growing up or just dealing with this whole mess. I don’t see the point in forcing her to see a Muslim counselor, though. (I know they were trying to force her to see one. I don’t know if that is what really happened here, but I’m guessing based upon the circumstances.)
You see, I work in the legal field and Rifqa’s family and her CAIR appointed attorney actions have been raising red flags. They were on the verge of being jailed for contempt of court the first time and now, who knows what their intent is.
The “Daddy” part is a little off and a bit heart breaking, I agree, but I believe her therapy needs to focus on Rifqa right now and addressing her need for a father figure. Why would she have a need for a loving father figure? Perhaps the father has not been honoring the daughter.
(I also want to point out that while honor killings are culturally based and not necessarily Islamic – death for apostasy is very Islamic and practice often. However honoer killings are quite common among Muslims. And honor killings have occurred here in the U.S. as well, and they have been by Muslims.)
Agiri–one of my greatest concerns in this case is the level of exaggeration and the publication of unsupported accusations. There were a couple of blogs that published the first broken deal story–which allege that the Barys cut a deal with the Florida court, by which the court would drop the requirement that they provide additional documentation of their immigration status and in return the Barys would consent to a foster care placement in Ohio.
There are several things wrong with this story–in addition to the fact that no one has presented any shred of documentation. John Stemberger–who has been spreading the story and was Rifqa’s Florida attorney claims that he was not a party to the deal. In addition, the Bary’s agreed to an Ohio foster care placement much earlier–as reported by Eric Fenner of FCCS on Sept 4. Finally–the ability of the court in Florida to make a deal that would bind anyone in Ohio to anything is limited. The final line of the story is always that the Barys then fired the attorney who made the deal. The only change in attorney that I can see happening at that time was the change from the Florida team to the Ohio team.
With regard to the current action–the court will have to decide if any agreements have been violated. And the court would have knowledge of exactly what each party agreed to. If FCCS et al agreed to ensure that Rifqa had no contact with the Lorenz family and the group in Columbus that connected her to the other folks who were instrumental in interfering with her family life, then, I would say that the court should ensure that they do so. There are many many churches in Columbus–and most do not operate on the shady side of the law in custody cases. It should be possible to find one.
please get your facts right. RIfqa is a young woman who ahas made a courageous stand for JEsus and has maintained that stand for four years. SHe is being kept a prisoner becuase the legal system in Ohio has decided to apply sharia law conswquences to her becuase of the publicity of the case and because of the official disapproval of CHristianity. THe fact that she was raped while in her mother;s care and while her mother knew the perpetrator and did nothing to stop it or bring th perpetreator to justice should have finishe off the claims of this sick and selfish family a long time ago. RIfqa’s brother is the reason she is blind. HE blinded jher during one of his beatings of her.GIrls are low on the totem pole in Islamic families. HEr father threatened her life.
You who would rather ignore these things are outrageous. How dare you conclude that a young woman should be left to shuch a family as this and against her will. They could easity take her back to SriLanks. THe father lied to get them here illegally. If she is sent back they will marry her off and or kill her. Think before you let go a river of false compassion. IT is really poison.
While it is understood that non-Christians would be confused by what I was writing about, it is disturbing that many people that claim Jesus Christ are also confused.
We stand on who God is and what He clearly states in His Word. Our God is an awesome God; He loves us and desires only the best for us. In return, we worship, praise, honor and obey Him. He is our Savior, our Protector, our Master. In Him, we have no fear.
1 John 4:13
By this we know that we abide in Him, and He in us, because He has given us of His Spirit.
What does it mean to abide in Him, and He in us? Too often, we Christians, (especially in North America) have no idea what it really means to “Abide in Christ,” and “Walk in the Spirit” as opposed to walking in the flesh. Not many of our churches teach it very well.
Watchman Nee, a Chinese evangelist, did an excellant job explaining it. He pointed out the need to rest In Jesus in all things. Life suddenly becomes much easier when we do.
He told the story of a young man drowning, while his friends sat helplessly on the shore. One of the friends, who was an expert swimmer, stood still watching while the others frantically urged him to jump in and save the young man. “What is wrong with you! He’s drowning! Save him!” He said nothing. Just watched.
Finally, when it looked like the drowning man had become too weak to continue and was going down for the last time, the expert swimmer jumped in, raced to his side, grabbed hold, and pulled him to shore.
The friends, hysterical at this point, pointed to the exhausted victim and yelled at the rescuer, “Why did you wait so long!” “Why did you make him go through that if it was all so easy to just go out there and get him!”
“Because,” the rescuer responded, “If I had gone out there earlier, while he was still strong and panicked, he would have grabbed hold of my neck and drowned us both. I had to wait until he was done fighting before I could help him.”
And so it is with Jesus. While we are still fighting in our own flesh, He reluctantly stands aside; loving us and desperately wanting to help, but knowing that until we finally give up and admit to ourselves that we can’t do it on our own – He can only wait.
When we have finally come to the end of ourselves and sincerely desire His help, He comes in and does the walking for us. That is when we are walking in the Spirit. And that is the Spirit that you see in so many oppressed and suffering Christians around the world, who, despite all the circumstances around them, continue to sing with the peace and joy of the Holy Spirit.
Have you heard the stories of Haitian Christians singing praises to God? Look at some of the Christian news sites, where they report on such things.
It’s hard for many of us, myself included, to truly “Let go and let God,” but when we do, there is nothing more wonderful than walking in the Spirit.
All these accusations from people that don’t understand what it means to “Abide in Christ” – Not once did I say in any of my writing that Rifqa MUST return to her parents and be murdered. All I have said is that, as a Christian abiding in Christ, there is no fear.
Obedience to God, honoring one’s Father, and being the witness we are all meant to be, – loving others more than our selves – is of utmost importance.
However, while I have said that one evidence of obedience to God would be obeying her parents wishes by not contacting the Florida family, I have no idea whether or not she is to return to her parents. And no one else, outside a prophetic Word from the Lord, knows either.
Pray for Rifqa, that God’s will be done. Not anyone else’s will. Pray that God will lead the judge to make the right decision, and that Rifqa and her parents will all accept it as well as grow closer to God through it.
And by the way, as Christians I am sure we can all agree that if Rifqa’s parents are trully as bad as so many that don’t know them say that they are – then most surely we Christians want the best for them; that they come to know Jesus Christ just as their daughter has. The best way for all of us Christians to help with that is to pray for them, and to be Godly, loving, and kind witnesses to them.
John 3:16 “For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son,[a] that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.
I pray that we can all love others in the World that much – no matter how evil we might think they are.
Praise God, my brothers and sisters! We serve and awesome, strong God, who is totally in control, knows all things, and loves and wants the best for us!
As a precondition of Rifqa’s removal from Florida to Ohio she was to stay in foster care, and not be returned to her parents. This has been undermined at every opportunity since she arrived back in Ohio by her parents and their attorney.
To claim that she derailed this agreement is factually wrong and dishonest. The parents have not lived up to their agreement in Florida and now refuse to sign the agreement that was reached a few weeks ago. Clearly you have a very weak understanding of law and legal manuevering, and who is holding up the conclusion of this case.
It is simply fantastic that you transfer your expierences with your daughter to Riqa. I have news for you. Not all parents are good, and that you claim daughter ran away simply because your spouse passed on due to cancer- is very telling-there was much more to the story. A tradegy such as the passing of a father would drive a healthy happy family closer, not apart. That you still blame it on this demonstrates you are unwilling to face facts, and take responsiblity for your actions and family welfare. The fact that she lives close by and visits nearly every day may be acceptance of an overbearing parent rather than true desire to see you. More likely, you have smothered her into submission.
I am one of those people who got someone else’s inablity to raise their children dropped in my lap. The girl was homeless, not attending school, and the parent could not have cared less. Her mother wished to not take the most basic responsiblities for her.
Rather, I spent my time, money and effort picking up the pieces of a dysfunctional family
And oh yes, when the hint that she might have do something was on the horizon, she often feigned that she couldn’t because of cancer- and was in Chemo- which she had not been in for years and years. Every time one of my deadbeat tenants does not want to pay “Cancer!”. The amazing rally cry of irresponsible people everywhere it seems.
All of my life’s problems are due to cancer!
In Rifqa Bary’s case there is already a history of violence in the family (her eye).
It is the court’s responsiblity to determine the best course of action in HER best interest- Not her parents. Both states have been consistent thus far in not returning her to the family. She needs to take every precaution to ensure her own saftey and welfare. That is baseline. The rest of your chatter and babble from someone who alienated their own daughter should be discounted. Although it is fortunate that there are people like the pastor and his wife who were able to receive Rifq when she needed them. And I don’t regret straightening out the young girl- no one else was going to do it- least of all her “parent” better referred to as a breeder.
Picking up:
It is hard for me not to get sucked in again to this conversation, but you have some highly questionable pieces of the story. I have read many people charge that there was an agreement made in Florida by which the Barys agreed to allow Rifqa to stay in foster care in exchange for not revealing an illegal immigration status. Not only have I never seen any documentation, but the final court hearing when this is supposed to have taken place was closed. And Rifqa’s lead attorney, John Stemberger (one of the parties spreading this tale) claims not to have been involved in the deal. On top of all of this is the reality that a court in Florida would not be able to bind a court (or Childrens Services) in Ohio to anything–let alone have anything to say about immigration.
Likewise, the specific terms of any agreements made in Ohio with regard to promises to limit contact with the Lorenz’s (or any other parties who aided or harbored Rifqa in running away) are known only by those parties and the judge. So–the statements about how the parents are backing out on deals strike me as being purely speculative. We do know that FCCS had earlier raised concerns about Rifqa having any contact with the Blake Lorenz–and the DCF in Florida had asked the court to ban all contact with the entire family.
As an adoptive parent, having contacts with a good many other adoptive and foster families, I can attest that not every runaway is running away from bad stuff at home. Some are. Some run away from the foster homes that they are placed in to keep them safe. I have know children to run from adoptive homes where they have been loved and well-cared for back to a home of origin that was neglectful or abusive. Some run in the illusion that they can escape problems that in the end they carry with them. Some run back to families of origin out of feelings of responsibility or loyalty.
If only life were so simple. There is a great book, written by adoptive parents, called “Wasn’t Love Supposed to be Enough?” which details the adoptive experience and the many ways in which children respond to family. I have also know bio families who have that one kid who for some reason has far more difficulties than all the others–in spite of having the same parents, the same family as their siblings.
BTW–the child who was homeless and not attending school: did you make a report?
Your entire piece is specualtive, so I’m glad you are struck by speculative statements. In reality you have never met Rifqa Bary nor have I. So lets get the obvious out of the way. Everything you or I say is speculative in regards to Rifqa. Secondly, do not put words in my mouth. Nowhere did I claim that the Barys are illegal aliens. They may be they may not be. I don’t know nor do I think it is relevant to the case. It is a seperate and distinct issue that would not be addressed in family court. To imply such demonstrates a failure to understand the legal system. Frankly, as it applies to the welfare and long term outlook of Rifqa Bary I really don’t care. If the State of Ohio cares it can investigate. But it would NOT be contained in any family court proceedings- and the fact that you imply that no mention of their immigration status in family court transcripts as “evidence” of any standing as to their resicency, legal standing in America displays ignorance of legal proceedings in family court and could be construed as an attempt to spread dis-information. It also demonstrates your investigate ablity and deductive logic as lacking.
Secondly, you are correct that the State of Florida cannot bind the State of Ohio. But, Florida was under no obligation to release Rifqa from Florida’s custody. Rather, it could have kept her. Therefore, perameters were set. It is unusaual for another State to undo another State’s decision. There usually has to be significant cause for a court even to take an interest. There has been no significant cause in this case. Try as they might, Rifqa parent’s attorney has put up smoke and mirrors and grandstanded endlessly-but there is no substance. The court seems to be moving in a direction expected and appropriate for the benfit and welfare of Rifqa. Further, if you were famliar with Florida Case law specific to Family Court you would know Florida is the wild card, and famously tried to exert its power over a New York Court decision. So yes Florida HAS tried to exert influence over other states, although it is highly unlikely that it will do so in this case ( I state the obvious so that you don’t claim that I imply that they will in this case because I will state right now there is less than .01% that they will.)
Further, I would be much more confident that the lawyer involved in the case would have a much better handle on what is occurring than yourself as an outside third party observer. You can SPECULATE, but you don’t really know.
And now we come to the core question- is Rifqa running away because she is a troubled teen or because she is in real danger. Neither court has returned her to her parents. Ohio has given no indication that it will. You totally ignored the ruined eye- yet still cling to the idea that Rifqa could be a troubled teen runnning away from good parents. Rifqa is not an adopted child, and I don’t think your being an adoptive parent makes you a better judge of the situation. Rather, you cling to the idea that Rifqa is running away from good parents for whatever personal reasons you may have. The facts are that 2 courts have not returned her to her parents, and short of a trial that seems unlikely at this point- and unlikely with a trial for that matter.
As for teens running away because they are rebellious there are some. There are also plenty of bad parents, abusive parents, negligent parents, and other defectives who breed without the slightest tinge of guilt and gift a lifetime of hurt and pain to children.
As to imply that Rifqa is a difficult child without truly knowing her, and her circumstances is pure speculation on your part. Following your claims and logic. Not every runaway is running away from good stuff.
Knowing children who have suffered under abusive parents, negligent parents not every child should be made to suffer under the roof of people who are unable to properly care for children- even their own.
PU–in your initial post you stated: “As a precondition of Rifqa’s removal from Florida to Ohio she was to stay in foster care, and not be returned to her parents. This has been undermined at every opportunity since she arrived back in Ohio by her parents and their attorney” My response to this was to refer to the circulation of a story that there was a deal struck in Florida as I outlined–drop the requirement that they produce additional immigration documentation in exchange for the agreement not to oppose foster care. This story (unfounded as you note due to the family court totally lacking jurisdiction over immigration matters) is the only reference I have ever seen to any agreement for ongoing foster care until the age of 18. If this is NOT what you were talking about, please clarify.
Florida was in fact required at the end of the day to release the case to Ohio. Their initial refusal to do so was grounded on the interstate compact not being invoked because there was no case on file in any Ohio court. This caught everyone in Ohio by surprise because there had been until that point no need for a case to be opened. There was no suspicion of neglect or abuse. Nor crime had been charged. This was what ultimately sparked the unruly charge (which many have charged puts the Barys in a bad light)–as running away does in fact constitute unruliness.
I would agree with you–the Florida family court has been quirky over time, to say the least. In the end, however, they would have had to cede to outside authority–as they did in the cases of Elian Gonzales and Terry Schiavo.
I don’t know that I could honestly advocate for a return home at this time. I don’t believe quite honestly that this family has the resources to deal with this situation–given the numbers of well-meant outsiders who believe that it would be heroic to assist in another “escape.” But I cannot put aside the very real possibility that a viable family has been destroyed by the efforts of unrelated zealots. I strongly suspect that there was a point before all this happened when responsible family counselling might have been very helpful. And I hold accountable all those who dabble in ministry without an appreciation for the responsibility to minister to individuals and families–even when the families are outside the faith.
Thanks for putting words in my mouth again, and twisting facts. I cannot comment on an article I have not read.
There was no pending case in Ohio, because none had been filed, and that is not evidence or proof that no abuse was occurring. That no complaints were filed- which would be pretty common with abuse- because only a fraction actually gets reported or filed, and in no way is conclusive evidence that none was occurring. It only means Rifqa or others close to the situation had not filed a complaint.
As for Ohio, it got embarassed fast. And backpeddled. No, Florida could have made it painful and slow.
This family had problems long before any media attention was put on it. The unruly charge is one of many things that cast doubt on the validity of their intentions towards their daughter. I am curious to discover what you consider a viable family.
Thanks Adoptive Mom-
I’m glad you are up on a lot of the points concerning the legalities. I also appreciate that you are a mom that sees the diversity of children, and has a willingness to understand with Grace. I like you! It’s great to communicate with someone that can see these things. You mentioned that you’ve adopted transracially – and I too, have a transracial family. That adds another dimension to family dynamics.
Back to the point of the article – Rifqa has taken on the name of Jesus Christ. Those that haven’t made a study of what that really means won’t understand the article.
I didn’t place the name of Christ on her. She chose it, and with that choice, came a responsibilty.
The only reason that fundamentalist (usually Evangelists) Christians are jumping on this Rifqa Bary bandwagon is the ‘islam bashing’ factor that unites them.
Americans abuse more than 3 million kids every year.
About 1500 of these kids are killed.
About 70% of these 1500 kids are killed by their own parents.
Where are the Christians campaigning to protect these kids from real danger that they face?
All I see is ignorance & hatred from so called ‘Christians’ in their attempts to malign a religion which they know almost nothing about. The little that they think they know has been fed to them via the anti muslim media that has its own agenda.
There are some good Christians such as the following:
http://www.tampabay.com/news/perspective/christian-attorney-why-i-think-rifqa-barys-mother-is-in-the-right/1037250
But just look at the abuse he gets from his own people just for stating facts that he knows!
Indeed, I did say there was a precondition- because the legal proceedings in Florida ended abruptly not because there was a judgement- but because the two sides had reached an agreement- at no time did I say that it was because of the Bary’s residence status in the U.S.. This is your big thing to try and lump me with this. In a previous post I did state my position on their residence status, and will not repeat it here. I don’t know what triggered a sudden agreement between the sides- if Rifqa’s attorney had some leverage he used to his clients advantage good for him (whatever it was- which I don’t claim to know or care-because again it is not germain to the case)- but no the negogiations would not be recored, or be a matter of public record. But I do want to be clear in no way am I refuting an article. I don’t know the source of the claims, but if Rifqa’s attorney made such a claim as you state- that would be a primary source of information, as it is the attorneys that represent the clients and actually do this. My comments are not targeting that article, but rather your logic. I will say lumping me together with individuals who raise the issue of Bary’s residency status is akin to me lumping you with CAIR- because your talking points are complete and pure CAIR press release talking points. I don’t do that because I think its a cheap shot- and would prefer if you don’t do that to me. Rather, I believe you are misguided in your analysis- but I think you have arrived at your conclusions based on your own convictions and are not a CAIR shill, although you may be a useful idiot of CAIR.
Further, you admit that one state cannot bind one state- Florida’s legal proceedings started BEFORE Ohios. The Bary’s attorneys knew they stood to lose much more in Florida than they did in ohio- and it was in his clients best interest to attempt to move the venue to Ohio. If judgement had occured in Florida- Ohio would have had to petition the court, and proceedings would have moved very slowly. your vague citing of the state’s compact would not have nessicarily forced Florida to return Rifqa to Ohio if the determination that the Bary’s legally lost custody. Infact, your response was so odd that I felt I could not respond to it until I understood what you were trying to say. Finally, it is unlikely that Federal Courts would intervene without reason- Family Courts are notoriously the proving ground of states. Elians case had many considerations of international relations and many legal question marks- but was resolved the way it was resolved inspite of this.
Finally, it seems higly suspicious to me that Christian Adoptive Mom and Lisa are one and the same people- and I invite any techie to do an i.p. address scan- to see if that is the case- because the speech patterns, logic, and timing seem to point to this conclusion.
Since you don’t know Rifqa personally it is impossible to know where she is in her spiritual journey. It is also quite pridful amd misguided to pretend to know God’s will and plan for her. God did not start Jesus’ ministry into his 30’s. Perhaps God has a bigger plans for Rifqa than to perish at the hands of a violent and abusive family.
>>”Finally, it seems higly suspicious to me that Christian Adoptive Mom and Lisa are one and the same people- and I invite any techie to do an i.p. address scan- to see if that is the case- because the speech patterns, logic, and timing seem to point to this conclusion”<<
LOL. Go ahead. Do your scan. And thanks for the compliment!! Christian Mom seems like a neat lady.
BTW, – I never, ever said I knew God’s plans for Rifqa. The article is actually quite clear about that. So it’s funny so many keep saying that I’m throwing her to the wolves. All I have said is I know the commandments he has given His people – and honoring ones parents is a huge one. I’m not going to re-write the article here. But please – do go back and read it correctly, and post on what was actually written.
Bless you, though. I DO appreciate your thoughts, even if we disagree. God be with you, in all sincerity. May He touch you with His loving Grace.
Here’s an interesting post that goes into the legal issues fairly explicitly–particularly regarding the roles of the Florida and Ohio courts. The author and I disagree regarding the postulated danger that Rifqa faces from her parents, but I believe that he does a very clear job of explaining the legal issues and decisions http://jewishodysseus.blogspot.com/2010/02/thoughts-on-rifqa-bary.html
The heading is misleading — there’s no evidence what-so-ever that Rifqa “fudged” the agreement; her counselor decided it is in her best interest to allow her to communicate with certain people, and so she can: PER the agreement. It is her parents who are going back on their word. It is not Rifqa who is refusing to see them, it is her parents now merely because they are angry she WAS ALLOWED to speak with the pastor.
I find it amazing you have not one critical word of the parents; yet they were from the very start mainly concerned with THEMSELVES and with saving face. They went to far as to publicize selected passages from the Rifqa’s diary: an extremely cruel thing to do to a 16-year-old girl. And now they are once again proving that gaining their daughter back is NOT their primary purpose. They are clearly willing to throw that away just out of wounded pride. Yet it seems conservative Christians like you are unable to see that. No wonder so many kids of yours rebel — they cease to be sure you really love them.
Well, lumping millions of conservative Christians together in a statement concerning our children is certainly just as prejudicial as lumping all Muslims together.
If you have never had a moment of rebellion with any of your childen, you have done an amazing job and I applaud you for it.
I am not addressing the culpability of the parents because, if you would re-read the article again, I am addressing the “taking up” of one’s cross; something that pertains to the purpose and point of our Christian walk.
Rifqa tells us she is servant of Christ. Her parents have not.
My personal opinion:
(background a Born again Christian (family) turned buddhist from Rifqa’s fathers home town Galle, Sri Lanka)
Seems like a ploy from a teenager who wants to live in the US at any cost. Fair enough. Substitute the name Rifqa Bary with Maria Sanchez and no one would care less.
More likely the push would be to get her sent back to Mexico.
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