Comments on: Responsible Dissent http://www.bloggernews.net/13823 High-quality English language analysis and editorial writing on the news. Wed, 07 Jan 2009 20:27:41 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.3.3 By: Responsible Dissent : “7.62mm Justice” ™ http://www.bloggernews.net/13823#comment-3340 Responsible Dissent : “7.62mm Justice” ™ Wed, 14 Mar 2007 11:49:52 +0000 http://www.bloggernews.net/13823#comment-3340 [...] Responsible Dissent [...] […] Responsible Dissent […]

]]> By: peterbroady http://www.bloggernews.net/13823#comment-1172 peterbroady Tue, 16 Jan 2007 01:30:30 +0000 http://www.bloggernews.net/13823#comment-1172 Sniper One, Since you have been kind enough to read my blog (since I started last month I wondered if anybody really read them) and give me my first comment, I will give you my take on what you say here (I should also say that I hope you have not read my comments and responses as harsh or irresponsible). I share some of your frustrations with opponents of the war, and do not like pointless partisan bickering much either. Also, I think you are on the right track talking about elections. However, I think popular participation and public involvement in decision-making is essential to a functioning democracy. This seems to me the biggest lesson of the U.S. civil rights movements and other people's movements around the world (like the anti-apartheid movement in South Africa, and many others). While laws were passed by national leaders that abolished slavery, granted suffrage to women, guaranteed civil rights, etc., the only reason this was ever able to happen is because regular people, and often the poorest and most downtrodded people in the country, expressed and acted upon their dissent in a remarkable way. It is this element of American history and culture that I find most beautiful and important, and it should continue to grow and not be stifled by secrecy or arrogant and, I would argue, truly irresponsible people in power. On the dissent from the Iraq war, I would simply point out that opposing something is logically equivalent to advocating its opposite, or some other alternative. So when someone comes out and opposes the proposed "surge", they are advocating a decrease in troops and a way out. And there is nothing wrong or irresponsible about opposing a plan that you think, for a number of reasons, is not likely to "work" (whatever that is supposed to mean in Iraq). Those that advocate immediate withdrawal but still say that we have responsibilities to Iraq (for reconstruction, humanitarian aid, etc.) have the beginnings of a very definite plan, one that has much more popular support. I would suggest that you read some of the detailed critiques of the Iraq war from the beginning, and some of the many proposed plans for what to do by scholars and even lawmakers. The president's plan would be disasterous, and is based on manipulation, secrecy, and hidden motives as has been standard practice during his entire administration, especially since 9/11. Scholarship is nearly unanimous on this point, and the American people are waking up and realizing they have been manipulated. Almost anything is better than escalating this disaster. That, as I see it, is the point to all this dissent. Also, do you really see our leaders as father figures, and the American people as little children who can't stand the truth? Good God man. Considering all the things that regular people understand better than our national leaders (like that it is a bad idea to proliferate nuclear weapons), I would opt for a more egalitarian picture. Your metaphors are interesting, though. Have you ever read George Lakoff's Moral Politics? He analyzes some of these very kinds of metaphors. It is an interesting work. Keep writing and thinking, good sir. Sniper One,
Since you have been kind enough to read my blog (since I started last month I wondered if anybody really read them) and give me my first comment, I will give you my take on what you say here (I should also say that I hope you have not read my comments and responses as harsh or irresponsible). I share some of your frustrations with opponents of the war, and do not like pointless partisan bickering much either. Also, I think you are on the right track talking about elections. However, I think popular participation and public involvement in decision-making is essential to a functioning democracy. This seems to me the biggest lesson of the U.S. civil rights movements and other people’s movements around the world (like the anti-apartheid movement in South Africa, and many others). While laws were passed by national leaders that abolished slavery, granted suffrage to women, guaranteed civil rights, etc., the only reason this was ever able to happen is because regular people, and often the poorest and most downtrodded people in the country, expressed and acted upon their dissent in a remarkable way. It is this element of American history and culture that I find most beautiful and important, and it should continue to grow and not be stifled by secrecy or arrogant and, I would argue, truly irresponsible people in power.

On the dissent from the Iraq war, I would simply point out that opposing something is logically equivalent to advocating its opposite, or some other alternative. So when someone comes out and opposes the proposed “surge”, they are advocating a decrease in troops and a way out. And there is nothing wrong or irresponsible about opposing a plan that you think, for a number of reasons, is not likely to “work” (whatever that is supposed to mean in Iraq). Those that advocate immediate withdrawal but still say that we have responsibilities to Iraq (for reconstruction, humanitarian aid, etc.) have the beginnings of a very definite plan, one that has much more popular support. I would suggest that you read some of the detailed critiques of the Iraq war from the beginning, and some of the many proposed plans for what to do by scholars and even lawmakers. The president’s plan would be disasterous, and is based on manipulation, secrecy, and hidden motives as has been standard practice during his entire administration, especially since 9/11. Scholarship is nearly unanimous on this point, and the American people are waking up and realizing they have been manipulated. Almost anything is better than escalating this disaster. That, as I see it, is the point to all this dissent.

Also, do you really see our leaders as father figures, and the American people as little children who can’t stand the truth? Good God man. Considering all the things that regular people understand better than our national leaders (like that it is a bad idea to proliferate nuclear weapons), I would opt for a more egalitarian picture. Your metaphors are interesting, though. Have you ever read George Lakoff’s Moral Politics? He analyzes some of these very kinds of metaphors. It is an interesting work.

Keep writing and thinking, good sir.

]]> By: Cassin http://www.bloggernews.net/13823#comment-1149 Cassin Sun, 14 Jan 2007 20:06:17 +0000 http://www.bloggernews.net/13823#comment-1149 Right on! Right on! Right on! I'm sick of people being against Bush just to be against him. With no real plan for action or change. I'm tired of being forced into Devi's Advocate, merely because there are no angels. I hope that more people will have some of the same feelings and that we will unite together and tell Congress (and Bush) what we think and why we think it. So that the government will know that even as "children" we have voices and we are not afraid to use them. Often times I sit and think what the changes need to be to be successful. Sometimes I hear rumblings from the government that perhaps there are some there that are thinking about them. However, I never see them enacted. Maybe it is time for the rest of the moderates out there to stand up and give a plan of action that will leave both the left and right wingers speechless. Thanks for your great words. Victory through unity!! Right on! Right on! Right on!

I’m sick of people being against Bush just to be against him. With no real plan for action or change.

I’m tired of being forced into Devi’s Advocate, merely because there are no angels.

I hope that more people will have some of the same feelings and that we will unite together and tell Congress (and Bush) what we think and why we think it. So that the government will know that even as “children” we have voices and we are not afraid to use them.

Often times I sit and think what the changes need to be to be successful. Sometimes I hear rumblings from the government that perhaps there are some there that are thinking about them. However, I never see them enacted. Maybe it is time for the rest of the moderates out there to stand up and give a plan of action that will leave both the left and right wingers speechless.

Thanks for your great words. Victory through unity!!

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