Friday saw the long awaited release of the forensic evidence found by the FBI and the Oak Ridge National Laboratory in mother Casey Anthony’s car. Certainly there was no new news, the vast majority of the findings were leaked to the press weeks ago.
What caught my attention was not what was said, but the manner in which it was said. The English language is full of nuances and subtleties that put spin on what is being said. In some ways you can compare it to the glass half full, or glass half empty situation, optimism versus pessimism. Note the very subtle difference between the following two phrases “is consistent with” and “is not inconsistent with”. At first sight these phrases have the same meaning, but they don’t, the first one is the upbeat optimistic and positive phrase, the second is the double negative pessimistic version.
So what did the prosecutors say yesterday?
About the hair found in the car trunk -
“This hair is microscopically similar to the Caucasian head hair recovered from the q15 hairbrush, however a more meaningful conclusion can not be reached as this is not a suitable known hair sample.”
“Therefore, neither Casey Anthony nor Caylee Marie Anthony can be excluded as the source of the Q12.1 hair.”
About the hair sample on the shovel -
“Therefore, both Casey Anthony and Caylee Marie Anthony can be excluded as the source od the Q46.2 hair.”
About the odor analysis -
“It is important to note that gasoline was found in the vehicle trunk which presented a significant chromatographic signal and overlapped with approximately 41% of the chemicals typically observed in decompositional events.”
“….indicates that a portion of the total odor signature identified in the Florida vehicle is consistent with a decompositional event that could be of human origin.
Note the use of the words ‘could be’ rather than ‘is’.
“These results still do not rule out the remote possibility that an unusual variety of products or materials (not present at the time of vehicle discovery) may have had some contribution to the overall chemical signature.”
A seasoned trial lawyer will make mincemeat out of these reports in a courtroom. Jose Baez et al must be rubbing their hands with glee! For the prosecutors to make a murder one wrap stick they better have an ace or two up their sleeve. While few of us doubt her guilt, this evidence doesn’t stand a cat in hells chance of getting a conviction. Juries are notorious for disliking cutting edge scientific methodology, the evidence becomes an acronym soup of mumbo jumbo far beyond high school biology classes. When you combine that with the scientists own disclaimers it is no wonder that often scientific evidence becomes a hindrance rather than an asset in obtaining a conviction.
All quotes taken directly from the released documents, they are available here.
Simon Barrett
(4 votes, average: 3.25 out of 5)
Loading ...
1127 users commented in " Caylee Anthony – No Smoking Gun From The FBI Lab "
Follow-up comment rss or Leave a TrackbackThanks Simon. I do not dispute you at all. However, I do believe LE has more than they have shown, that there is a great chance Caylee’s remains will be found, and that the overwhelming circumstancial evidence will get a conviction of at least manslaughter. Plus there are 4 counts of lying to police which there is irrefutable evidence of, and enough evidence on the check charges to get time in prison. If all they can do is get her behind bars for 25 years, then at least she woun’t be out having more babies, and the better part of her pole-dancing days will be over.
That being said, I STILL hold big hope for a murder one conviction.
I have to agree simon that it is not real clear on hard evidence.. from what I heard though,they said that a live caylee hair and then a decomposed hair can be found in that trunk, so that is now up to the defense to dispute why a live caylee hair and then a dead one??? i did hear that… there will be a conviction, no doubt or fears about that, just on what charge though stumps me, I am getting confused.. anyone wanna help me with what all I missed yesterday??
SAME crap as usual from the scamthony camp !!
SAME LIES !! same spin
AND WITH THEIR FAVORITE WORD,,” ABSOLUTELY ”
“Today’s released information proves absolutely that there has never been and still isn’t any connection whatsoever with Casey Anthony having committed any crime. Ms. Anthony, her mother, father and the Baez law firm continue to believe that Casey’s daughter is still alive.”
BULL ! THE DNA EVIDENCE IS SOLID !
1. The hair with the death band is from caylee or casey !
2. The % odds of the dna being from anyone else is very very low almost 1/1,000,000 or something like that,, but it is possible
Todd Black, of the PR Firm (Let ME Confess FOR YOU!) probably wrote that (see ACT’s 9:42 am post with quote).
Hey, Todd, her name is CAYLEE!!!!
She wasn’t even three years old! And as far as committing “any crime” how about misplacing your daughter and not reporting it to anyone - ever! Until your mom blurted it out to the cops! Sounds like a crime to me!!!
I agree with you Arrest Cindy Today - the entire Ant camp is disgusting! (I like the “scamthony camp.” That’s good.
You’re right Simon! You have to disect every sentence word for word that comes from either side. Nothing is said without great thought and preparation.
I believe 100% that she is quilty. I used to feel sorry for Cindy…now she’s just pissing me off. I do expect her to support her own kid, but her laughable “good mother” comments are an insult. Doesn’t she remember that we’ve heard all of her taped conversations and 911 calls accusing her daughter of all kinds of dispicable things??
I support the death penalty on this case! If she didn’t want to be a mother any more than give the kid to someone who does.
Simon,
I have followed this case from it’s beginning. I am the father of two daughters, so I have a heightened interest. Caylee looks a lot like my oldest daughter at that age! So, I hurt everytime I see her! Heck, I hurt regardless when any child, let alone my own, is injured or killed!
I agree with you. I didn’t feel like this evedinece was IT! I guess a lot will be depend upon how this evedience is presented in court and whether is stands up to cross examination. But for Baez to say that, “it’s not in my client’s best interest to reveal what she knows about Caylee’s disappearence”, can’t be overlooked. Also, Todd Black’s slip of the tounge on CNN, referring to, “the loss of life of this little girl” is significant too!
I do think that LE has something else for this case we haven’t seen. I heard a cellphone expert from Casey’s provders on TV say, ” Just forget everything surrounding this case. All the lies, Casey’s families involovement and public attention on this case. Without my revealing LE’s hand, we have enough proof here to covict her! This record of her trail is overwhelming and will be difficult for anyone to defend!” He said, “trust me, I have testified at many cases that brought a conviction with much less information than we have here!We can pinpoint her exact location at the exact time of day!This is my opinion, is very damaging evedience against Ms. Anthony! It’s a ‘no-brainer’ for a jury!”
I assume this person will provide a detailed look at the pattern of cell pings and information much more specific than the scientific information released yesterday. The defense may contest the validity of the scientific evendience, but there are many other forms of eveidence that they’ll have to address. The cellphone pings and technology could hold the biggest key in the case.
I keep wondering why noone has asked for Casey’s tax forms. We had child care for our children their entire early childhood. We had to do a background check of our provider, file taxes on the care with our provider and vice versa, had a paper trail of checks written to our provider and exchanged numerous detailed “emergency” information with our babysitters.
There are holes all over this Zanidea/babysitter story! Casey’s tax information would provide answers to the questions concerning her method (lack of) employment and income status. Too many, changes of stories and theories in this case. Too many trails to cover up. It’s my hope that the prosecutor will leave no stone unturned!
This may sound outlandish, but when I hear Casey talk about “Zenida” I think she’s talking about herself! I think she made this other person up to distance herslef from the crime and hurt of killing Casey. She says, “not everything I’ve said is a lie.” I think this means, she is Zanidea. “She’s the last person I saw Caylee with”. Could she be telling the truth? Casey=Zanidea.
I do know this! Nothing that Baez or Casey says concerning thie chance to tell the truth, will make me say, “Oh I completely understand!” NOTHING! Recent delvelopments of a young boy abducted by “drug cartel” in Las Vegas prove to me that Caylee would be back with no harm after all of this attention. For God’s sakes, drug dealers brought the boy back alive after public outrage.
I ache for Caylee’s soul, understand Casey’s parents “inconditional love’ and hope and pray Caylee’s remains are found! As far as Casey’s concerned. She and her family will have to live with what they know the rest of their lives. That may be the worst punishment one could ever deliver!
Dan
Simpsonville, SC
Dan, wonderful post! well said…
Hello Simon: I agree the language nuances are truly important.The fact that most of these facts were leaked earlier certainly did lessen the impact of the findings, however one must envision these facts which we have known about for months being presented in totality to a jury.The facts will unfold like a murder mystery novel and many of the deductions made by the jury will,one hopes, be based on common sense deductions…the initial report by Cindy in a panic, the lying,the jail calls, the cover ups the various strange twists and turns, etc.etc. Unfortunately the jury will be hobbled by the rules of decision making according to the judge.I do feel though that the downfall of Casey will depend largely on her own words and actions and those of her family. Do not forget that we have as yet to hear from the prosecution as to whether this will be a murder one charge or not and why Baez has not requested a speedy trial. One can only hope for the discovery of a body. We can see the direction of the defense case by the Kobelinsky statements on NG last night…doubt, doubt, doubt!!! I believe that without a body the best we can hope for will be manslaughter.
Coco - My regard for C has gone down the same road. The kindest thing I can say at this point is that she should be in a padded room for her own sake and everyone else’s (including G). She’s not even helping little Caylee. I don’t think she has been since sometime the night of July 15th when she realized that the child really was dead - then she went nuts.
And Dan from SC -Great post and thank you for info about cell pings and the reminder that there is other evidence we don’t know about that will help convict her.
Hey, Coco, Dan from SC and Arrest Cindy Today!
bloggernews.net provides articles on this case frequently and a bunch of us are following the case closely as you are.
This is a great blog and I hope you stick with us or at least join us when your time permits.
In case you look in and don’t know what/who we’re talking about here’s the “key:”
LE = Law Enforcement (the cops)
C = Cindy
G = George
LV = LeeVick (so nicknamed after kicking over the water bowl of a peaceful protester’s dog)
BB = Baez (stands for Big Butt, Butterball, BoBo the clown etc)
Count - Frilly Count or Count Dracula = Mark Nejame, criminal defense lawyer for C & G
Ants = Anthonys (usually all of them or at least three)
And last and definitely LEAST is M (stands for murdering maggot monster etc) - You probably don’t need more clues as to who that stands for.
Most of us never use “M’s” name because we do not want to add to her notoriety/celebrity. The name we want the spotlight on is Caylee. So that’s why we came up with these - plus they’re just shorter to type!
So please come back and join us when you can!
I have to go to work, I’ll check back tonight. I missed alot. and to the old blog, and all the bickering
GROUP HUG!!!
I’m going now bye bye
Hi, pammyliz! Hug back! We’ll have to wait for our more learned bloggers to come back to answer some of your questions about the case, okay? I would if I could but I don’t want to get it wrong. Have a great day and “see” you later!
salukisighthound -’morning! Great comments! And I particularly appreciated “I do feel though that the downfall of Casey will depend largely on her own words and actions and those of her family.” They have well and truly done themselves in! We can only hope for a jury that HAS common sense and will act on it.
No matter what has happened to little Caylee it is M who is responsible for it and should be held responsible. (”Held” preferably for 25 to life if that’s the best we can get!)
I don’t think the jurors are going to be swayed by the lack of DNA, The percented of the testing are on the greater side of possiblities.
Exp: If you need 100% proof, but you have only 80%. I think the jurors would concluded the differents…Plus, the juror has to take in the other evidence at hand… Momster had 31 days to cover up a crime. Thats alot of time…
Anyone who is anyone will figure that out….
It may not be a death or life sentence but it will be a good amount of time….
Right, alliethinks!
I sort of wish she would plead guilty now, tell the truth (probably not even possible for her) and get it over with. Can she possibly think that she’s going to walk away from this? Not be held accountable in any way for Caylee?
Maybe her idiotic lawyer has her believing so.
But how can that be now that he’s brought in Lemon (the death penalty expert lawyer)?
Can’t anyone talk any sense into her?
NG experts said it best,” Momster is in a Lawyers bubble,” The only thing on momster mind is the day she can start her life over with no Caylee….
She has no remorse towards Caylee, non!
She is living on the high hopes that Bobo and lemon are going to creat enough reasonable doubt in the minds of the juror to set her free….
Ain’t going to happen, Plus, I would like people to refer Caylee as a 2 years old toddler, other then a 3 year old. That child was not nor did she have the opportunity to turn 3…Saying the age of 3 gives the defense more reasonable doubt cause that tells people Caylee made it to the age 3.. ANd that she was not killed back in June…
regarding comment from Dan in sc. I particularly was interested in your comment regarding M=Zenaida. I always focused on that comment as well, the hesitation in M’s voice when she made the comment”Zenaida is the last person I saw my daughter with”. Very possible knowing the convoluted way in which she thinks!
Yes I think it’s awful that most of the press refers to Caylee as “3 years old” when she never got a chance to see three candles on a cake. Better to say “almost” or “nearly” or “not yet” 3 year old, Caylee Anthony.
It’s disrespectful and you’re right, alliethinks, it helps perpetuate the false hope/idea that she was alive at least until then (Aug 9) or may still be alive. We pray for that but most of us don’t believe it, sadly (thanks to M and the rest of the “scamthonys.”)
Well if Momster thinks the movie ” American Psycho,” is a favorite in her book. It goes to show you that creating a split personality is easy way for her to keep composure.
Media referred Laci as the age she was last seen and the trimister that her baby was in, 8 months.
Reguardless of an age change the toddler went missing at 2…
We shouldn’t even be using the word 3,
Even the media is playing the age of Caylee being 3, but thats not the truth. No one knows that Caylee made it to Three, so why say it…
M2C, your right use a different term for the age…. Like stating the facts that Caylee would be 3 years old if found.
I guess I’m over reacting a little..
When this all goes to trial, I’m sure the state is going to wear out the age of CAylee being a 2 year old toddler…and not ever making it to the age of 3….
alliethinks - No you are not overreacting at all. This poor child deserves all the respect we can give her and her age is very important!!! To think that a child did not get to see her third birthday because her mother was too selfish is enough to make us all sick!
(Call in the CDC! They’ll eradicate M right quick!)
Maybe we should just be as factual as possible and say something like “Caylee Anthony, who would have been 3 years old on Aug 9″ or “Caylee Anthony, who was about 2 years and 10 months old when she disappeared.” Or simply “2 year old Caylee Anthony.”
I’m for that! Poor little tyke.
alliethinks - when I read “that creating a split personality is easy way for her to keep composure” I giggled thinking, “Well, it should be! But wouldn’t you think that one of her personalities would have the sense to tell the other one to try to look like she really missed her daughter?” And then I realized that, no. Whether M has one or a hundred personalities none are that compassionate nevermind intelligent.
Great post Dan! I was disappointed at the phraseology used by the forensic science report. I’m sure that is why it took so long; they really wanted to nail it and couldn’t. I’d like to know the percentage of car trunks in the US with that chemical composition however. What are the odds it happened to poor M at this particular time? The circumstantial evidence is truly overwhelming, and cannot be explained away in its entirety.
this ehole case has gone from unbelievable to just sad, for one the hair came from one of 2 people one who is obviously alive, not to many people have a decomp smell in thier trunk, i might have believed the ants if they had ever gone on a hunt for thier grandaughter, or if m had called the first day, the whole family is trying so hard to make m look like mother of the year while no one has given any thought to a innocent child, m behavior alone looks guilty to me, i hope tim and paddy find evedince of a body, or le has a little more evedince that they arent sharing, i suppose its in gods hands now i can only pray with the rest of you there will be a big break.
Simon - Your article echoes the same fear and frustration we’re all feeling right now (shades of OJ trial).
However, I must admit I - (thankfully) - don’t have to read many such reports and wonder if that is normal science-speak these days, using verbiage that is not about positive conclusions but simply probabilities in delivering these test. Other testimony might be able to be use less restricted language than scientists to describe their impressions.
I’m sure that even cell pings aren’t absolutely precise because more than one tower in an area can be used at any given time, although they certainly narrow the playing field in pinpointing general location.
I am beginning to think that we need to simply trust how this data will help add to the probability of a well-constructed REASONABLE explanation given the tsunami of other circumstantial evidence that basically eliminates any other feasible scenario. No one piece of data is a slam dunk but together they are chillingly compelling.
Let’s face it, Casey lied on her original police report the night she was found by saying she most definitely dropped Caylee off at the “nanny’s” on June 9, despite larding her statement with copious detail and being given several chances to revise it after it sounded odd. It wasn’t until police examined the dated photo of Caylee on 6-15 at the nursing home that Cindy revised her theory that it was the last time she saw her.
If you can’t even fabricate a single excuse that can be corroborated from minute one, then any other scenario you ask others to believe instead is equally implausible.
Dan, Coco and others, welcome. I hope you find this blog as cathartic and lively as I do.
Dan, I think the complete absence of any nanny records, including emergency numbers, is totally telling because Cindy and George looked after her most of the time - unless she was tagging along with her mom. Until June, no one had heard much about any “nanny”, just a local babysitter who watched Caylee on infrequent occasions. Cindy and George were as surprised as the general public about the Zani story, but they had to hide it because, they too I suspect, had only heard the name after Casey left home, and could not react to the public about their complete unfamiliarity with this person without blowing their daughter’s cover. I am sure Cindy asked her a billion times about this new “nanny” when she supposedly accompanied Casey to Tampa and got such a mouthful that she thought she knew. She may not have ever gotten a straight response from Casey about any details (her number is in the phone I just lost, transferred my SIM card, blah blah blah). And at the point Casey was constructing her nanny story, she was in complete control of the situation, supposedly withholding visits due to moving out after the big blowup. I’m sure C and G felt they were walking on eggshells asking her for the time of day.
The jury will immediately see that creating an elaborate story about a non-existent nanny right around the time a child goes missing does not point to kidnapping but something far more sinister. I don’t think we need a shred of forensic evidence to plant that seed in the minds of jurors.
allie - fabulous points about her age! referring to her as age 3 only reinforces the silly kidnapping theory, which was tossed well before her third birthday came and went in August.
IF they found a CADAVERIC hair in the trunk, and it is either Casey’s or Caylee’s, then OBVIOUSLY it is Caylee’s since at last documentation-Casey is ALIVE–so it can also be concluded that Caylee is DEAD. See how the media leads down the path of BS?
Beans I think you are right about the words chosen because of science and absolutes. Mtdna means you can trace the mother’s side of it which means only partial strand. They can only say that it was M or Caylee’s hair. Well if it is decomposed hair and M is sitting the court room. natural conclusion is that only realistic possiblity is Caylee. who no one knows is at. As far as chain of evidence on the car, tow company had no keys, therefore had no access to interior of car or trunk. Unless they can prove it was pried open that will not wash. If they want to say a body was placed it in at the Ants home. O.k. still limits both the guilty and victim. Every needs to remember a grand jury came back with a true bill in 30 minutes. That would seem to me that they had alot more evidence than this. Plus we don’t know the dates of missing website searches, Chloroform searches, and how they were searched ie. get your toddler to sleep or how to kill a toddler? The LE science computer people will know how to find that info. They also may have records of what was erased off of myspaceor facebook. They haven’t released alot of stuff yet. Trust me this case is SOLID. Finding Caylee will only bring closure and futher evidence. M is gonna be convicted.
I also thought it interesting that reports mention gasoline in trunk. Maybe M didn’t use the gas to burn body or evidence maybe she poured it in trunk to try and kill the smell. Can’t use argument that there was not a body when she ditched car becasue her own texts messages reference the smell in the car before she ever ditches it. Even sent text messages. If LE has copies of messages she sent about it. That will be better than her testifying… cause you can bet her defense will try and never let her on the stand.
Where is Lisa Williams for this case?? I think this kid is in several locations and that the landfill should be reviewed as well as the dumpster by the boyfriend’s house.I think the FBI has more info. on this case, or there would not have been an indictment. I think there has been ” a lot of schooling ” since the OJ trial…
subee I agree grand jury would have told them to come back later. This is too big a case to go forward with if there is not enough evidence. We are just letting media and BB defense plant seeds of doubt. IT WILL NOT HAPPEN M WILL BE CONVICTED. EVERYONE CAN WRITE DOWN WHAT I SAID AND WHEN. I was even right on the time of the grand jury. If this was all the LE had I would agree it is suspicious, but how many of us have read Annie’s interview with LE, or the mechanic friend? Seen dates for web searches, and know all the cell tower pings and places and times. We also only have general info about cadavier dogs and where they actually hit, We have heard alot about some things, but a case needs to be presented logically and totally in order to be honestly decided. The only people to hear all the evidence LE has so far is GJ and it took only 30 minutes. There were experts who thought it would take longer even a day or two to go through. THere is a reason it was that fast.
“You see, Pinocchio, a lie keeps growing and growing until it’s as plain as the nose on your face,” explained the Blue Fairy.
Even Geppetto went frantically searching for Pinocchio when he went missing.
Good afternoon everyone!
good afternoon Ca so what are your thoughts on the “new” evidence.
Justice for Caylee Puzzle.
I’d like to start creating our own “Justice for Caylee Puzzle” on this site. I will post the starting point in a few minutes. I’m not sure how many of you will want to go along with this, but I think it will be great for us to compile a list of puzzle pieces that creates a picture of Casey as being guilty of first degree murder. Then we will be able to see how many of our pieces are actually used in the trial. We can always add or subtract to it as we go along.
Anytime you want to add a piece to the puzzle, please start your post with the words:
“ADD TO THE JUSTICE FOR CAYLEE PUZZLE” That way your post won’t be missed. I’ll start my next post with that sentence. If no one is interested… I totally understand and will simply drop it. It’s just an idea I had.
C4C - I was under the impression we would have ” a smokin gun” I was disappointed as I skimmed over much of the “mubo jumbo” as to not find something more damning…I mean, maybe they would of summed it up in more laymens terms might sound better to me…
I really didn’t see anything we haven’t already heard…Not happy with things at the moment. I have been thinking for a while now that since the 30 minute GJ verdict..( which worked out to be only 5 mins delib. on each count)…blew me away…that they heard alot more then we know about. They are NOT allowed to talk about the case for a reason I guess. The biggest proof yet is not for public or better yet, jury tainting….I am feeling very impatient that things are continuing to move so slowwwww….and Nov 8 still seems so damn far away…I hold out hope and faith that god does not let M get away with murder and he will guide the ES team and our sweet paddy to our baby’s remains and get the last nail pounded into M’s coffin…I hate her so much!..she needs to suffer….long time.!
MMT - that’s a great idea (i’ve been listening again to George’s interview and taking notes).
It it all so confusing, that it would be good to have a compendium in one place.
Hi CA, subee and scj!
re: gasoline in car trunk, I think that can be explained by the cans she had stolen from the shed that George retrieved in that little confrontation on 6-24. He also mentioned in his interview, btw, that he had reported the cans missing because there had been other minor thefts, gas missing, around the neighborhood for awhile. And he said he thought his daughter had been stealing gas because he saw gas marks on the side of her car that would happen if it was poured from a can. don’t know if the cans were still full or if she’d used them, but spillage from them being there would have certainly explained that.
Ca I KNOW that is going to happen.
ADD TO THE JUSTICE FOR CAYLEE PUZZLE
Great comments today! Although, we were a little disappointed to hear that LE didn’t have more evidence than what we were already exposed to, there is no reason to lose confidence in the case. Keep in mind that the prosecution team will slowly fit the pieces of the puzzle together until the picture is clearly completed and the jury will plainly see, without reasonable doubt, that M is guilty of premeditated murder.
In most cases a defense attorney will announce that there is not enough evidence to convict their client, M’s attorneys are no different and, as you can see, they are already playing that card. But let’s not forget the pieces of the puzzle! Remember, AFTER Caylee disappeared, that it was:
o M’s child who is missing
o M who was last seen with Caylee
o M who failed to report Caylee missing
o M’s car with evidence of human deposition
o M’s car with hair evidence of a death band
o M’s car trunk where cadaver dogs hit
o M’s backyard where cadaver dogs hit
o M who had a motive to be carefree and party
o M’s hours of idle time which provided opportunity to plan and execute
o M who looked up missing children’s sites on her computer
o M who looked up recipes for chloroform on her computer
o M’s lies that sent LE on a wild goose chase, wasting valuable time
o M who lied to her parents and friends for two years about having a job
o M’s lack of emotion and sorrow for her missing daughter
o M not revealing to anyone that Caylee was missing
o M’s carefree actions & attitude that appeared as if nothing happened
o M’s unwillingness to help LE locate her daughter
o M happily dancing while her daughter is missing
o M getting a tattoo, representing “A Beautiful Life”
o M’s mom who reported that the car smelled of decomposition
o M who stole checks from Amy & purchased items, but none for Caylee
o M who is unable to provide even one REAL person involved in her story
o M who called from jail, saying “All they care about is finding Caylee”
o M who borrowed a shovel from a neighbor
o M who was out near a remote area of the airport
I’m sure that I missed many other pieces to the puzzle that you can help me with.
So, if you have a missing piece to add to our puzzle, please start your comment with the words ADD TO THE JUSTICE FOR CAYLEE PUZZLE so that your post will not be missed. Let’s see how many of our puzzle pieces are actually used in the trial.
I feel like we are a justice for Caylee team!
CA - i know what you mean, as stupid as I think G and C were in dealing with that girl, i have a feeling she just wore them down over the years with her persistent and elaborate lies. they were just numb and battered. well, at least G was - I think C had simply met her match.
it’s funny that G described C and M as having the same types of personality in his interview. That’s a conclusion the general public seems to have reached in the matter of a couple of weeks watching their behavior. Different, but definitely similar.
I totally agree with this. I think that anyone can convey anything they want people to beleive with creative word use. I actually am sceptic to Casey’s guilt. Yeah, ok, she didn’t call the police, no one is acusing her of having brains. Caylee should be the main focus.
c4c…you say you KNOW she will be convicted?
MMT - great list. nothing really to add, maybe revise - we might not be able to judge the fact that M did not buy anything for Caylee at Target as proof she was murdered. Remember M claims, in retrospect, that Caylee was already “missing” then and so she wouldn’t have to justify purchasing items for her because she “doesn’t know” where she is. It fits in with her ridiculous alibi, but I think the jury will still be shocked at how carefree she managed to act during this whole time.
o.k. not having brains is one thing…. in all these months she has never looked for Caylee. only cried when it was about herself.
cecybeans, thanks… I was excited to read your message and find that you’re all for creating the puzzle list. This will truly pull us all together, as a team, in wanting to see Justice for Caylee.
Please go over my list and see what pieces you can add… I already thought of a couple after reading your comment but I will wait for your reply.
Maybe we can post the list on the first day of every month.. or maybe we can ask Jan to post it somewhere else for us to look at. What do you think?
Jan, if your reading this, please give us some ideas.
Most…CAYLEE is our main concern that is why we are praying she is found and trying to figure out how and why M would do such a horrible thing…not calling police for 31 days to me screams cover up…not brainless…heartless maybe, but everyday that she didn’t call was another day to party without the responsiblity of being a mother to her little ‘SNOT HEAD’…and another day the remains of HER CHILD..decompose more leaving little to no evidence in her mind to convict her….she is GUILTY OF ALLOWING WHAT EVER THE TRUTH IS, TO HAPPEN TO HER DAUGHTER. Her baby is dead and she is responsible for NOT protecting her and there for causing her death.
and I think it’s even more ominous and creepy that she was telling Amy and others that her parents had already/or would soon leave the house - divorcing, mom getting a condo in Winter Park, etc. and that she was living there herself with Caylee cuz they had left it to her. makes you wonder what her long term plans might have been….
Yes… there is enough evidence for a conviction. Can I say murder one…not yet until we see more evidence. BUt yes I truly believe she will be convicted and they will find her body.
beans…having the house to herself…yup..mom and dad are JUST LEAVING IT FOR ME…in her fantasy island world…
c4c - Counting on LE’s ace up their sleeve i know they have one.
CFC - I still say the body will not prove murder one - a body with attending cover-up could still be an accidental homicide, unless they could prove a violent cause of death absolutely - head trauma, choking, etc. Even the chloroform evidence could still be a felony manslaughter. It’s all the circumstantial evidence before and after that will make it look pre-meditated.
you might be right. however the searches that she did on her computer depending on the nature of questions in reference to chloroform, and then the missing children’s site could be enough to prove premediated.
heck, the evidence they have already, all the testimony and lies and BS from that whackadoodle. I think they could do it now without a body.
no mom worried about a child being “kidnapped” could have had that much fun 24/7. i think somebody on the media said she was out looking for that little girl about as much as OJ was looking for Nicole’s killer when he was on the golf course.
reason I am not 100% yet is that info all we have is leaked stuff so if it is not concrete then she might could get a lesser charge.
CFC - that’s what I meant (but didn’t express well) - i think the premeditated part - the part that would bring us Murder one - will be with stuff that is not the forensics. And there is PLENTY of that!
cecybeans said,at 2:52 pm ‘We might not be able to judge the fact that M did not buy anything for Caylee at Target as proof she was murdered. Remember M claims, in retrospect, that Caylee was already “missing” then and so she wouldn’t have to justify purchasing items for her because she “doesn’t know” where she is. It fits in with her ridiculous alibi”
***
Thanks, I think you’re right about that one. I guess I was thinking of that being supporting evidence for the prosecution because it shows that M knew there was no reason to buy even the smallest thing for her daughter because she wasn’t coming back. But, you made me think through it a little bit more and as a mother would I buy something for my child if she or he was kidnapped? Heavens… I couldn’t even walk much less shop.
beans..i think a body will prove murder one…if they present the whole case and her state of mind her my space pages the comp searches on chloroform and missing children her lies her spending her not calling 911…the hair and decomposition …the shovel..the ..the…the…
imo the only thing they need here is proof positive the baby is gone….SLAM DUNK TO ME..
The hair strand found in the trunk showed signs of decomposition. As with blood testing for paternity “cannot be excluded” is the term used to indicate probability. One of the two possible individuals is alive in a detention center, one missing.
The strand might have gotten into the trunk of Casey Anthony’s without her knowledge. In fact, Casey Anthony could be covering up her mother’s killing of Caylee Anthony possibly shortly before Cindy Anthony notified law enforcement Caylee Anthony was missing; presumably she would have called the police to divert attention from herself once her granddaughter’s absence was undeniable.
It is also possible Casey Anthony’s continuous rounds of bars, men and pot are indicia of her profound grief of knowing her mother killed her child.
These scenarios are more plausible than alien abduction, yes. The lab reports remain solid evidence however; rarely are “smoking guns” EVER found.
yea but if I were worried about my missing child I would buy trinkets for WHEN she came home. If I couldn’t tell anyone about her “kiddnapping” at least I could comfort myself for when. All she bought is party stuff. It will be used to establish her state of mind. Carefree unconcerned and not planning for future with Caylee
C4C - it doesn’t matter if it was leaked - it doesn’t compromise the veracity of the facts or the deposed statements. They aren’t anything that can degrade like dna.
Heck, all of M’s BS in her very first police interview about it happening on the 9th when Caylee was kidnapped is a crock - she uploaded herself the pix from the 15th and should have remembered Caylee was with her mom in Mt. Dora. her detailed testimony of the date (which was Cindy’s first hypothesis) proves she is a bald-faced liar from minute one.
And there are gaps in what was leaked. I’m sure LE has much more than what we saw. I think the leaks were to create pressure. too bad she didn’t stay in jail the whole time. Spending weeks at a time with her atty didn’t help LE.
Hi Peach…..C didn’t kill baby imo…c is guilty of alot but not that …why would M cover up for a mother who she said ruined and runs her life!…and I agree…m has no remorse no grief..c saying m is a grieving mother makes me sick to my stomach…just wanna shake that whack job…grieving she is no longer a contestant at the hot body contest maybe….NEVER AGAIN…M’S HIPS GETTIN WIDER EVERY DAY…GRAVY FOR BREAKFAST….LMAO…EAT YER CAKE KILLER…
but if C did it and was trying to frame M she wouldn’t be on her side.
add to Justice for Caylee puzzle
M lying about getting call from Caylee on 7/15
M not taking any of Caylee’s things on 7/16
M leaving carseat/doll in abandoned car.
I donot like the word puzzle. Mainly because C used that word so often. Rather would use evidence.
7/16 = 6/16 on second
Peach and c4c…wow I get it now what peach was saying…framing M…oooohhh…possible i guess..
C4C - good point about state of mind. EVERYTHING she did points to the fact that, whether this child was either kidnapped or dead, Caylee was happy as a clam to play the perpetual “unencumbered mother” without thinking twice about the child. (although BB is probably going to say that the “instructions note” told her not to purchase anything)
I really don’t think BB will ever be able to unravel the pit of snakes lies she told to LE. The defense will probably just stick to trying to lessen the impact of the forensics to get her off death row.
I am not explaining very well. sorry Ca I only meant that since we hadn’t actually seen info. I wasn’t considering it fact yet. I was reserving judgement on that evidence until i see it. I do believe she is going down
hey snook!
beans…instructions…what mother would get instructions on such a horrible crime to follow while their child was abducted …(oh are we talking about the story m told about caylee going missing with Zanny and her sister in the park or the one at the apartments…)..>lOL…one at the park..ok..
AND NOT KEEP THE NOTE!…oops…LE…another laime lie I told to help find my daughter….
yep it all makes perfect sense “in a backwards sort of way”
lol..absolutely!
Hi Caylee-Angel
So glad you came back._Against advise of hubby, I suspect, (evil grin).
Sad to see Mamabear, my close neighbour is still MIA.
snook…thanks but on the contrary..hubby totally supportive…just asked if peeps being nice to me…LOL>>>
I would NEVER let something this blown out of poportion scare me off…I am here for caylee and love the company…caylee has given me a cause…and taught me a thing or two …
My post was taking out of context totally…but I will move on…I have broad shoulders…so long as I am welcome I will be here…
Haven’t been on much so must have missed something. But I have never heard anyone critical of you Ca I think you will always be welcome. You bring alot of good debate and questions to conversation
Yah, I feel bad for mama I love her and she is way too hard on herself…I am sorry I said something that in the end….cause of the continued disrespect from a certain poster..upset her enough to make her leave……MAKES ME SAD.
when did this happen I thought mama was on Thursday night.
c4c - Thank you ….I have a big heart and it aches for Caylee and have attached to this beautiful child like the rest of you…I don’t stir the pot hardly ever…just wanna fit in and express thoughts honestly without arguing like most of you!…
Eliminating the implausible leaves the most probable: Casey Anthony is responsible for her daughter’s death. Whether her actions were deliberate or negligent is a separate issue. The crimes may not have started until after Caylee Anthony died. So far, the prosecution’s public actions seem like a manslaughter case, with subsequent crimes aggravating the severity of the initial wrong.
ADD TO THE JUSTICE FOR CAYLEE PUZZLE
I think it’s a great idea to develop a list of evidence/information about the case for all of us to see, MMT. And if anyone’s testimony is not corroborated we could put a (?) next to it (like I did with G saying last time he saw M and Caylee was June 16) Others have better records of dates and activities than I do but here are a few:
May 24 M and Tony L meet at a party for first time
June 15 - C saw M and Caylee for last time (?)
June 16 – G saw M and Caylee for last time
June 18 (?) M borrowed shovel from neighbor
June 27 – Car left at Amscot
June 30 – Car towed from Amscot
June 30 – July 5 Tony on vacation (M stays with Amy)
July 8 – 15 Amy on vacation. M drives Amy’s car
July 5 – 15 M stays with Tony
Hi Peach, - if Cindy killed Caylee it doesn’t explain George’s statement about seeing her alive on the 16th and leaving with M to go to work.
G was the most continuously cooperative Ant with LE. LV made a lot of calls and gave a lot of info but slunk into the background pretty quickly.
The strongest emotion I ever heard in Cindy’s voice was during those 3 911 calls - she sounds desperate for LE to help them find both Casey and Caylee. She and G both sound desperate in their initial interviews - to find the car, to arrest Casey for theft, to explain the dead body smell in a car they didn’t even have access to. Only when it becomes clear their daughter is a murder suspect do they pull back from cooperating.
Only Casey, who led police on wild goose chases and laughed a lot during her initial interviews, acts like she could have cared less throughout. And she would have thrown her mom under the bus in a heartbeat. Her anger at her mother putting her in jail and concern for herself only is so apparent in the angry tone she has in those jail phone calls.
And C and G had utterly no motive for killing a child they lavished with love and affection and financially supported. If it had even been an accident, they would have been on the phone to 911 in five seconds.
If anything, they C was using that child as leverage to get their daughter to behave better. I just don’t see Cindy as being a reasonable suspect.
c4c - last night..most did not even get what the conflict was…it was blown out porportion enormously…and dragged on….silly actually…
I think it is because we all believe so deeply and care so much that it gets heated sometimes. I also think that since we don’t personally know each other sometimes we may mean one thing and someone else reads another.
DON’T BE SAD CA. I NOT FAR AWAY. LU
NOW MMT- HOW ABOUT THE TIME LINE?
COME ON OUT LILRED. LETS PARTEA
Do you really think Mama won’t come back. I think I have her email I will drop her a line and see how she is. She has also had trouble sleeping and so maybe she will come back. Sometimes staying away a few days can clear our perspective a bit.
wtg I knew you wouldn’t be gone we would all miss you too much mama
Oh mama I am so happy to see you…I am so sorry for not taking the time to help you out last I was just so pissed at the reaction…
**************
Thank you for not letting “losing” you be on my concious for life…
YOU made my day…
AND I WANNA PARTEA TOO MAMA….XO
CA - please don’t get upset when we argue. It’s tres american to debate and bristle - we sometimes aren’t as laid back as our canadian cousins. (all that revolutionary residual). it often looks more bombastic than it is or is meant to be.
it only gets out of hand when people take it personally. which, given the high level of emotions this case gives all of us, is probably natural from time to time.
I think everyone yesterday was tired and upset and let it go places it wouldn’t have normally gone.
I told mama it was like a sister-spat and that everyone would get over it quickly. I just think she is very tired - needs a good night sleep. I know I do, I was up all night combing through the records on this. I need a 12-step program to detox me from the Anthony mess!
MAMAMAMAMA! You could hear us calling your name!
HIIIII-EEEEEE!
THANKS E1. I LOVE YOU ALL.
for real sometimes I research and then come here and chat and then it gets questioned, then I try and go back and find it and its gone. Then I wonder if it was ever there in the first place. For example we were discussing reports and one that no one seems to be talking about are finger prints on shovel.
MMT I LOVE THIS IDEA. BET JAN WOULD POST IT FOR US.
C4C THAT WAS IN THE EVIDENCE CAME BACK FROM THE LAB-YESTERDAY
yea but what about the shovel. What does everyone think about it.
beans…I don’t get upset with arguing…I am used to it…my house has 3 teens with attitudes and 2 babies in training…caos is my first name…should have maybe used that as my blog name…no worries…I was worried for mama and anyone else who is not used to such bickering…I am good…and I am here till the end with all my friends…
WHERE IS CAYLEE?…THAT’S WHAT ALL THIS IS ABOUT…
HEY YA’LL. I GOT FLASH NOW. WOW AM I THE LUCKY ONE OR WHAT………….
this is not evidence, but just something odd I noticed about C.
She is always so sure of and specific about dates (even when she’s not).
She first said she had not seen Caylee since June 9. Then she told the police 31 days, which would have made it June 14th (and she gave both statements on June 15th).
Then later she told the media that the pizza had been in the car for 12 days - which doesn’t match up to any date. Whazzaup with the pizza date??
She might be a lot like M, (who is a lot like The Enquirer) - if I say it, or think it, it’s gotta be true! Amy said that M tended to believe her own bs.
C4C IT IS IN THE REPORTS. THEY FOUND A HAIR THAT WASN’T M OR CAYLEE’S ON THE SHOVEL.
AND THEY FOUND NO FINGER PRINTS ON THE SHOVEL. AM I NOT UNDERSTANDING U?
yes I know thanks. But my question is why isn’t anyone talking about WHY M had a shovel in the trunk of her car?
i had not heard there was a shovel in the trunk… I knew about neighbors shovel only.
concernedforcaylee said,at 3:08 pm yea but if I were worried about my missing child I would buy trinkets for WHEN she came home. If I couldn’t tell anyone about her “kiddnapping” at least I could comfort myself for when. All she bought is party stuff. It will be used to establish her state of mind. Carefree unconcerned and not planning for future with Caylee.
***
Thanks for the thought concernedforcaylee… I will leave it on the list.
LMFAO CA—-I HAD 4 KIDS AND I KNOW WHERE U R COMING FROM. COULD TELL U SOME WILD STORIES. BUT NOW I AM OLD AND STRESS EASY. I SHOULD NOT HAVE JUMPED IN WHEN I DID. SORRY FOR THAT.
I was not disappointed with the released evidence report.
Forensic testing is never 100% accurate. There is always a margin of error. However, that margin of error becomes smaller and smaller as multiple components are indentified.
Example 5 lottery numbers. Big difference with the probability factor having one number right vs 5 numbers right. Ditto with for example air sample from trunk having 5 major components of human decomposition identified.
Reasonable doubt, how to quantify. 95% sure, 5% doubt. Again very seldom 100% either.
Hope this makes sense.
thanks I think your idea is a good one because those of us that are following it will like it as a reference and reminder of facts
IT ISN’T AS MUCH WHAT SHE “DIDN’T” BUY AS WHAT SHE DID BUY. “PARTY GIRL”
MAMA…WHEN I READ that the hair on the shovel was not m’s or cayless….I know the defence will use that up and and down and three ways sideways to say…SOMEONE ELSE KILLED BABY AND BURIED HER…it doesn’t make sense at all cause people shed hair all the time…it could have been transferred easily from someone else somewhere else…and transferred off M onto shovel..or belongs to neighbor..hope LE has dna from neighbor to disprove another possible and responsible guilty party other then M..
BUT..if they do have dna from neighbor..why not in the report saying it was theirs..means it belongs to ..IN THE DEFNESE EYES…THE REAL KILLER…THEY WILL USE THAT LIKE COCHRANE USED THE GLOVE…
Mama - now you can go and download all that video and audio stuff!! Hours of fun!!
CA - I’m glad to hear you’re okay. I love it when you get mad at M - you can be really funny!
C4C - I know what you mean about finding things - even with all the bookmarking, I’ve gone back to sites and seen stuff that is pulled, or I can’t remember where I found it.
We need a site archivist! Although the people who put up the Sticky Threads sites for Websleuths have done a great job of cataloguing all the various available evidence.
Combining and comparing cellphone pings and text msgs to see her whereabouts is my latest compulsion. I want to find out where she was that was a place she could have left that poor child’s body.
I’m sure the experts are all over it, but it’s really interesting to see her locations on those various days.
MAMA…TOTALLY…party girl…baby gone …buys beer and sex clothes…and ass wipe!…yah, c….grieving mother mode…she doesn’t see how stupid her statements are…she is totally about M…NOT CAYLEE
I think Cat was the one that said there was a shovel found in the trunk - NOT the one from the neighbors.
We were wondering which shovel had the hair on it, because if it was the neighbors shovel that had a not-Anthony hair that is innocent. If the one in the trunk had a stranger’s hair, it might mean something else.
I have been looking and can’t find an inventory of what LE found in the trunk.
BTW - I just read something again about the neighbor - (not all in published docs) - stating that he say M with her car backed into the garage several times that week. hmmm?
WELL, THE ONLY SHOVEL MENTIONED WAS THE NEIGHBOR’S AND THE NEIGHBOR SAID THAT LE TOOK THE SHOVEL-SO I THINK THAT WAS THE SHOVEL
another question is when it mentions that baby might have died in the trunk without oysgen. A trunk would have air. Unless over a period of time she used up the oxygen. That would indicate she was in the trunk for a long time. Especially if she were sleeping, one tends to breath even and slow consuming less oxygen
cecy - if you’ve got records of important dates in the case maybe you could contribute to the evidence/testimony list that MMT suggested and started. I think it’s a great idea!!! Please see MMT’s post at 2:35 pm and then I added some dates at 3:30 pm
MMT is going to try to keep the “master list” I guess. Some details about it need to be worked out but I think it will be wonderfully helpful to all of us. Something constructive for all of us to do now while news is a little slow and it will become something we can refer to when needed in future.
You know, maybe it would be a good idea to separate the list into things like:
forensic evidence
witness statements
suspicious behavior
they are all so different but they can work together to form the net of no reasonable doubt.
This was in a news article after evidence came out. Reliable?
Residue of chloroform, which can be used to render someone unconscious, was found on the spare tire cover and trunk liner, though a trace was also found in a control experiment on a similar trunk. No usable fingerprints were found on a shovel in the trunk.
BET GUMS HAS SOME STUFF……….
C4C U 2
I NOT GOOD AT KEEPING RECORDS.
I was under the imnpression too that the shovel in the evidence report was neigbour Brian Burner’s shovel. No shovel was in the trunk. Not on the evidence report either when car was confiscated/contents listed unless C did her magic disapparance act.
Tow yard employee also did not mention a shovel when the trunk was opened by G at the towyard. Only the white trash bags, flies , maggots and smell.
c4c…think maybe baby died in the trunk…under sedations with chloroform..in the heat…od on the chloroform….a trunk would not have alot of air exchange…especially if it was hot…shallow breathes in such conditions with chloroform…not good scene..
Hi Peach, - if Cindy killed Caylee it doesn’t explain George’s statement about seeing her alive on the 16th and leaving with M to go to work.
*********************************
YES, Casey is the most likely to be responsible. There are other POSSIBLE explanations but none probable. Only Cindy Anthony’s involvement would explain Casey Anthony’s silence for a month, but it explains nothing else. Casey Anthony’s life history does not suggest a person willing to take responsibility for her own acts, let alone those of others.
But was the death of the child a result of negligence or intentional act?
OOOOOOOOH…. AND THE SEARCH FOR THE CHOROFORM WAS LOOKED UP UNDER CASEY’S LOG IN ID
C4C - that is the one thing that is bugging me so far.
The decomp evidence shows it was “early” - like two or three days. That would seem to negate the theory that she had her in the car that for very long.
also, in addition to a lack of oxygen, I cannot imagine a child would have lived in the trunk of a car in FL on a hot summer day for more than a few hours. It is illegal to leave your child in the car in FL for any length of time because, even when the windows are cracked, it gets up to like 120 degrees in just a few minutes. the cook before they asphyxiate
snookers said,at 3:13 pm add to Justice for Caylee puzzle
M lying about getting call from Caylee on 7/15
M not taking any of Caylee’s things on 7/16
M leaving carseat/doll in abandoned car.
I donot like the word puzzle. Mainly because C used that word so often. Rather would use evidence.
***
Hi Snookers! Thanks for your GREAT additions. I added them to the list.
I hope you don’t mind us sticking with the word “puzzle” because a lot of what we have on the list is not evidence, it’s simply supporting facts to the prosecution’s theory.
Hey, think of it this way… Our Justice for Caylee team will show C the true meaning of what a puzzle REALLY looks like when it’s put together with evidence and facts and not just fiction!
GO TEAM!
Hi Mamabear
Be honest , were you lurking?.
So glad to see you’re back BTW.
I too, generally just disappear when things get hot and heavy.
Life is too short to get involved in that insignificant stuff.
interesting that those reports dont say where the shovel came to be? it explained every number up to that one.
cecy at 4:00 - Good idea. Up to you all and MMT how to do it. I do think a timeline of important dates would be important as well as the things you suggested.
MMT - I guess you missed my post at 3:30?
HEY SNOOKERS. WILL ALWAYS LOOK OVER YA’LL SHOODERS. LOL
MMT,
Had error on M not taking Caylee’s things,. Should be 6/16 as opposed to 7/16.
Puzzle is fine with me ofcourse.
Peach…don’t know about negligence or intentional..I do know it was NOT an accident.
The searches on chloroform and missing children and her my space poem tells me intentional act….along with her demeanor after baby was gone…she couldn’t give a shitt about her missing child…and to this day not ONE TEAR… Intential..not negligent…even negligence would mean nasty hoe bag so called mother that would at least cry over her loss…the only thing m has lost in her eyes is her right to party….
add to Justice for Caylee puzzle
AND THE SEARCH FOR THE CHOROFORM WAS LOOKED UP UNDER CASEY’S LOG IN ID
guess you have it…just start typing and your true feelings come out…SHE DID IT INTENTIONALLY….that’s why we brainstorm and when you just let your thoughts flow out on “paper”…you get your true feelings…cool
snookers, darn. I thought someone said there was a shovel in the trunk yesterday.
that would have been great, because it would have helped corroborate that witness who thinks he saw her in the woods with a shovel.
If the hair did not match, it could have easily just been from the neighbors. and since she borrowed it, any fingerprints would not be suspect even if they were there and readable.
of course, CINDY was alone with that car after they got it back for a long time. G went right back to work. If she was washing pants she could have been taking out a lot of stuff before she found M. like shovels.
I can’t find the LE inventory of the house search other than the computers.
also, C said there were “no maggots” in the car (of course, the bag with the pizza box had been thrown away at the tower’s). But the towing guy said he saw maggots and we heard the bag later tested for body fluids on the outside - not the inside with the pizza after it was recovered by LE. maggots have a specific life cycle, so hopefully they’ll call in an expert for that. I don’t remember if either G or the tow truck guy saw actual flies coming out of the trunk - that would be a specific time-line too.
LILRED——-U HERE???????????
MMT - don’t forget the doll they found suddenly didn’t have the pink dress on.
impossible to know if cindy washed or destroyed that I imagine.
THEY SAID N MAGGOTS ON THE PIZZA
NO MAGGOTS ON PIZZA
mytwocents-The Original said,3:30 pm ADD TO THE JUSTICE FOR CAYLEE PUZZLE I think it’s a great idea to develop a list of evidence/information about the case for all of us to see, MMT. And if anyone’s testimony is not corroborated we could put a (?) next to it (like I did with G saying last time he saw M and Caylee was June 16) Others have better records of dates and activities than I do but here are a few:
May 24 M and Tony L meet at a party for first time
June 15 - C saw M and Caylee for last time (?)
June 16 – G saw M and Caylee for last time
June 18 (?) M borrowed shovel from neighbor
June 27 – Car left at Amscot
June 30 – Car towed from Amscot
June 30 – July 5 Tony on vacation (M stays with Amy)
July 8 – 15 Amy on vacation. M drives Amy’s car
July 5 – 15 M stays with Tony
***
Thank you M2C original! Great stuff! I knew I forgot so many things. I’ve added your additions to the list.
I really appreciate your participation. I wasn’t too sure how this would go over with the group. Please keep thinking of more to add!
Mama - good point about M’s ID. I doubt Cindy or anyone else (maybe LV) even knew her ID.
mamam…no maggots on the pizza..pizza all dried up and moldy…no maggotts…they do not feed on food…they (to my knowledge) feed on decompositon of stuff like human flesh..and in every day garbage can stuff like …uncooked meat..
I am not sure but thought chloroform vapors are heavier than oxygen. Which could explain the anaerobic bacteria/properties.
I also still wonder what was on that JCP receipt that C would not relinguish.
According to the evidence report, there was no pizza, just an empty pizza box. That is the way I read it at least.
MMT - this is a great idea - we can always cut and paste this into a spreadsheet or calendar or something later on.
yikes! would you look at that! it’s afternoon already and my house looks like its own little crime scene!
I gotta go do some shopping (Target, natch, the BIG papertowels, please) and get some pasta to fix for dinner.
Not to mention, I’m running low on bleach and acetone…
It’s been fun sleuthing with you ladies - see you all later I hope! keep up the good work, we may think of something together that mama can mail to Paddy about where to look (still looking for a good intro for you!)
later! huggs!
snook…jcp…haven’t heard of that seems c is not willing to hand over credit card statements and jcp receipts…she looks really bad in a cover up doesn’t she…I don’t trust that woman at all…
I meant to ask from reading the fbi reports what anaerobic decomp. is?…is it later stage of decomp as opposed to aerobic which is initial stage?
cecybeans said,at 3:30 pm “George’s statement about seeing her alive on the 16th and leaving with M to go to work.”
Cecybeans, see, without realizing it you contributed to the list. George was the last person who saw Caylee alive with M.
Thanks! Please check those wonderful notes of yours and let me know if there is more to add!
later beans…ya funny gal!
snookers - I read somewhere it was a cross for Caylee or something - don’t know. Probably the bill was for $800 of sexy lingerie M charged and C was too embarrassed to show them.
Shit, M’s phone bills alone were from $300-500 a month - and that was 2007.
UR RIGHT SNOOKS-WAS NO PIZZA—–EMPTY BOX
CA (obviously I can’t get off this thang)
anaerobic just means oxygen not necessary or cannot happen in presence of oxygen for bacterial growth.
aerobic, the opposite - need oxygen.
A lot of decomp bacteria is anaerobic - starts from the inside out and stops when it reaches air.
Mama - so C was full of it when she said the car smelled like pizza because there was never any in there, just an empty box!
okay, i’m gone!
mama…there was NO pizza in the box? Maybe i was thinking of the theory “test” I think that fox did ..I did think there was some leftovers?
Cecy,
Yep, tow guy said some flies came out of trunk when opened.
That is why I also think, there is more forensic evidence than what was released to the public.I think LE hase an option as to how they file it. BB and cohorts should get all of it when completed though regardless how it is filed. Suspect testing is till going on.
Like to see M brought down by a fly/maggot LOL..
BYE BEANS
The prosecution has enough information to rip Casey apart in court. She has defined the ruin of her own credibility by lying so much, and there is enough dna evidence to prove her daughter is dead and was in the back of that car. I imagine there is also evidence which has not yet leaked to the press.
SURE HOPE UR RIGHT SNOOKS-THAT WE DON’T KNOW WHAT THEY WITH-HELD. THAT WOULD BE GREAT
http://www.freep.com/article/20081024/NEWS07/81024027/1009/NEWS07 in this link it references shovel found in trunk. Reliable news sourc? I don;t know
snook…yah a fly a maggott and a hair….pretty much sums m up !!! all disgusting!
HEYYY WECOGIRL. WELCOME TO THE CYBER-SLUTHS
just read testimony of neighbor it doesn’t give evidence number on shovel.
AM LOST C4C